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XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 - OCT 28, 10

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Offline smacker


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 3:55 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael,

presumably the damages would be paid by Knox and Sollecito rather than their families ? I assume therefore, the awarded damages will not be paid.
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:05 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

smacker wrote:
Michael,

presumably the damages would be paid by Knox and Sollecito rather than their families ? I assume therefore, the awarded damages will not be paid.


Hi Smacker. Yes, that's right...on both counts. However, someone like Yummi or Clander could clarify exactly how it works...but it's possible they may be paid the compensation by the state in cases where the defendants have no assets and then Amanda and Raffaele would owe the state, so it's the state that would be out of pocket. Of course, nothing at all will be paid (by Amanda and Raffaele) unless and until the guilty verdicts and awarded compensations are upheld in the third and final appeal via the High Court.

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THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
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Offline Solange305


Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2010 12:14 am

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:10 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Oh my god, Im so sorry, but this shit was too funny not to post. Justinian's defense to AK's cartwheels in the police station:


Quote:
Furthermore, cartwheels are a great way to restore circulation - especially if feeling light-headed.


http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php?p= ... ount=12611

I heard sex is a great way to restore circulation as well, perhaps Amanda and Raff should have just done it right there in the Questura! Im sure Justinian would have found that reasonable as well, after all, it is a great stress reliever...
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:12 pm   Post subject: MAMMA MIA, H9 (ACCA NOVE!!)   

h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
After AK serves her term and is released, will she be deported? She has said she would like to stay in Italy even after all this, but surely she is in LaLa Land...

I know The 411 has been channeling AK as of late, but after seeing this video, I think this is AK's message to the US fan club.... explains why she is favouring Rocco.

(VIDEO)


Mamma Mia, Acca Nove! :shock:

-----------------------------------------------------------------

As for me channeling AK, you know, I really can't help it. Let me explain.

I haven't been allowed to sleep for days, haven't been allowed to eat or drink anything, except some strange chamomile tea that made me say absurd things and then do cartwheels and act amorous.

I've been hearing these voices in Italian, angrily shouting at me "Stupida Bugiarda!"

Even worse, I received some "scappellotti sulla testa" from behind. Bam! Bam! Bam! pf-))
I was alone, and yet, those scappellotti made me feel that ...I'm not alone, even when I am alone.

I know The Bard is annoyed by it all, but I just want to say to her and everyone here that.... I'm just afraid of having the "Bonkers" mask forced on to me.

Grazie.



Last edited by The 411 on Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:14 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Justinian's defense to AK's cartwheels in the police station:


Quote:
Furthermore, cartwheels are a great way to restore circulation - especially if feeling light-headed.


Yes, but can they combat sheer stupidity?

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Offline TomM


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:14 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stilicho wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
stilicho wrote:
Michael wrote:
From the JREF:

JREF

This is complete nonsense written by the totally ignorant. No, they should not! British police work in such a way because they have a very short time with the crime scene before it has to be cleaned and handed back to the owner, along with all the contents the police didn't deem important in the first two or three days. This comes with it's own problems. Such a short time window which has to be rushed can lead to the missing of evidence, it can also lead to things being bodged.


I'd have to call shenanigans on this anyhow, Michael. Are you telling me that a terrorist lab, a backyard where a serial killer buries his victims, or a drug-smuggling boat has to be entirely investigated and returned to the owner within two days? I don't believe it. If this were true then a smart terrorist cell would own the property under one "wing" and have the rest operate clandestinely while renting from the "innocent" owner. Once caught, conceal and misdirect for a mere 48 hours and the other "wing" of the operation secures the property automatically.

Something's wrong with that story and I don't believe it for a minute.


It's a correct statement of a general approach to bag and tag quickly and efficiently, but no a crime scene can and will be sealed as required.


I'm sure they tried to do everything efficiently in Italy too.

I wonder if there's legal recourse for the property owner to claim damages from Knox and Sollecito.

Yes, Aldalia Tattanelli was awarded 23,000 euro. Collecting it is another matter.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:21 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Welcome, Smacker. SomeAlibi can tell you that when he first came on here, he was given a bit of a hard time. He hung in there, and we know how fabulous he is. I'm embarrassed to say this, but i think my first post was how to get the smileys to work :). I may have been ignored for awhile, but conveniently can't remember..........

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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:24 pm   Post subject: Buon Compleanno, Popper!   

Today is Popper's Birthday!...


mul-)

Tanti auguri, Popper!!
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Offline stint7


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:25 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

OT....OT

You deserve a break today: Watch a minute of two cats playing 'patty-cake


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvxCv_yr ... r_embedded
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Offline Solange305


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:25 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

haha, I see you couldnt resist that one either Skep lol. Justinian and his little gems of wisdom are just too good not to share sometimes....
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Offline smacker


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:28 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Capealadin,

thank you very much; I think this is my third set of welcomes so in fact you are all very polite. My login incompetence has no boundaries apparently. That is also the best truth I can think of.

That sentence almost makes me laugh out loud. I don't because the circumstances behind it are very sad.
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Offline Popper


Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:36 am

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:29 pm   Post subject: Re: Buon Compleanno, Popper!   

The 411 wrote:
Today is Popper's Birthday!...


mul-)

Tanti auguri, Popper!!


thanks a lot / grazie molte
Popper
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:34 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

You're welcome , Smacker.

Stint, thanks for that.

AND, A very Happy Birthday , Popper. I'm thinking champagne corks popping away.........

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Offline The Machine


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:37 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Cesare Beccaria has a new piece about Rocca Girlanda on TJMK:

http://www.truejustice.org/ee/index.php?/
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:44 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Happy Birthday Popper!! mul-) band-)

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:44 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks TM. BTW, what happened to the piece you were doing re: Young female killers? It's strange, because I was going to do a post on that...

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:45 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The Machine wrote:
Cesare Beccaria has a new piece about Rocca Girlanda on TJMK:

http://www.truejustice.org/ee/index.php?/



Thanks TM, that'll be a great read!!! :)

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
PMF ON TWITTER
PMF FORUM RULES
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Offline Popper


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:50 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The Bard wrote:
stint7 wrote:
bucketoftea wrote:
Emerald wrote:
The closer to the date of appeal, the more fearful I ecome.
No doubt the official court will come to the decision as I see it, but they are wiser and privy to much more nuance than I. Still, it's possible (improbable) the courts will conclude the evidence does not warrant a verdict of guilt.
I'm braced for the possibility.

One can never say never, I suppose, but I think it's unlikely. I'd be very surprised indeed if the conviction was overturned. Remember that the proseution is also appealing.


Me too

In sharing both the views expressed above, I am comforted somewhat when I consider that the 50% or even 33% overturn rates that are often cited may in effect be somewhat misleading.

Although I accept the fact of 33 or 50; but these percentages are for *all* convictions.

Some of which were not only not unanimous, but may have been as 'un unanimous' as requiring the Judge to cast a second vote to break a tie decision in order to declare guilt.

So, I submit that the *unanimous* convictions are overturned at Appeal much less frequently than percentages commonly stated, even in the TJMK Article which is the best I have seen anywhere.

http://www.truejustice.org/ee/index.php ... _what_we_/


The verdicts will not be overturned. The evidence is overwhelming.


First, very good work by Yummi on prints.

Second, I agree with the Bard
Statistics on the whole system are not so relevant. Murder statistics would be more interesting.

Country statistics are influenced by various factors (listed in extreme summary):
(a) prescrizioni (time limits for proceedings which do not exist in some other countries and recently were lowered for many crimes causing overturns)
(b) small crimes (especially white collar financial, little frauds, admin crimes) which in first degree may look like crimes but more experienced judges value them as mere mistakes [colpa or colpa grave] of the defendants
(c) cancellation of crimes (especially those which have interested Berlusconi. This resulted in overturns)
(d) Cassazione (Supreme court) sends back various trials to stage zero (re-trials) for procedural problems and mistakes
(e) verdicts must be well motivated in Italy which is not always easy - this does not happen in some other countries
(f) the fact that the criminal action is obligatory for prosecutors, they cannot pick

In the case of AK and RS IMHO chances of overturn are not higher than 1-2% (for factors we may not yet know) but if the case stands it is dead solid. Chances of reduced penalty exist but it would be a small reduction given that there is no partial or complete mental illness involved/requested (which causes most reductions in murder cases). Much higher chances exist for a life conviction (as in the trial of first degree vs. Rudy where he got life reduced to 30 only for "rito abbreviato"). The logic that aggravating circumstances are equal to mitigating ones was weak and clearly pro-defendants in the Massei verdict. New judges may not agree with that and give life or 30. Equal or slightly higher chances exist for an unchanged sentence.


Last edited by Popper on Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Offline The Machine


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:57 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
Thanks TM. BTW, what happened to the piece you were doing re: Young female killers? It's strange, because I was going to do a post on that...


Hi Cape,

The piece is about seemingly normal people who commit horrific and senseless murders. I'm currently tweaking it and reading some of the relevant literature about psychopaths.
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Offline Jools


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:59 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Girlanda's book presentation is over. I think I can easily predict that this book will be one massive flop! Who on earth will spend money to read this piece of Kak!

Here is a first report with some more 'creative' kak from Knoxy:

Amanda: unpublished letters, ‘I wish I could sing to the wind’
October 26, 17:16

Rome- ''I wish so much to ‘sing’ always freely to the wind, but obviously a caged bird, is more restricted than a free bird, in singing too. Before the voice the wings have to arrive”: it is one of the passages from a letter, as yet unpublished, that Amanda Knox, who was sentenced in first instance to 26 years imprisonment for the murder of English student Meredith Kercher, wrote on August 18 last from the Perugia prison to the heads of the Italy-USA Foundation, who many times have gone to visit her in prison.

The letter and it was announced today in the Chamber during the presentation of the book "I'm coming with you - Conversations with Amanda Knox in jail" (Piemme pub.), of which the author is Rocco Girlanda, MP and president of Italy USA Foundation.

"The sun is just rising - Amanda writes from prison - and I am writing this under calm semidarkness, one of my favorite moments, because the world is still asleep, and like people, the world looks peaceful and evangelical while asleep.”

"Shalom," concludes Amanda, who under the signature contains a sentence that she writes very frequently, it comes from a song by Jovanotti: "I know I'm not alone even when I'm alone."
http://www.ansa.it/web/notizie/rubriche ... 36075.html
tu-))
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Offline bucketoftea


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:01 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
stilicho wrote:
The Bard wrote:
h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1323765/Hayden-Panettiere-Amanda-Knox-movie-Meredith-Kerchers-murder.html
First look: Hayden Panettiere as 'Foxy Knoxy' in movie about Meredith Kercher's murder
The actress wore a brown wig and casual clothes for the scenes


She looks nothing like her. The only similarity is the IQ and crass insensitivity. "It's a great story" gushes Hayden...she is "honoured". She would love to have met Knox, but she understands why she can't (well done love). It's a long article. Meredith gets a full name mention in the headline (I guess every murder needs a victim, right?) but thereafter she gets one prurient mention - "Kercher" who was found "semi-naked with her throat slashed". Don't hold back now Daily Mail. Knox 'knows about' the film. You betcha. I suspect she is a little aroused by the prospect. So everyone's happy. Hayden, the little ingenue, doesn't "think anyone will have a problem with it". Oh reallllly? How so, young woman with curious made-up name? "Because of the way it's written"

Ah so! Miss P has spoken! (Stop with the Hollywood Chinese Confucius act. Ed)

So there we have it folks! Hayden has told us not to worry. It's kinda kewl. So let's just shut up and buy the popcorn. Nothing means anything anymore.


Hey Bard, is there actually any news in the UK? All the sidebars are about people either I've never heard of or don't care about. A lot of *ahem* plastic-looking "appliances" going on there too.

It's kind of like a small-town newspaper--real gossipy--except that instead of someone baking pies for the curling bonspiel it's people spending waaaaay too much money on things offering very little tangible return. Do the stories operate on a serialised basis? Is there character development?



Well, that is the 'showbiz' section, not the news section...so you won't see links to 'news'.


I think it's debatable there is any news in The Mail. A lot of promotion of various consumables (including prescription drugs through the back door) to their target socio-economic groups and those aspiring to them. And some scare-mongering. ;)
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:08 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Skeptical Bystander wrote:
stint7 wrote:
smacker wrote:
I thought I read somewhere here that there that at times of extreme stress the body was capable of producing odours that made little sense given the circumstances. I'd also have thought there'd have been little time to have enough sex for the odours to be so noticeable. If there was enough time, I can only wonder that the entire murdering event acted as a stimulant.


Hi again Smacker

Hope my lack of understanding of your particular 'Washington,DC type' of sarcasm does not again hinder my comprehension of what you are saying.

1) Please see above explanation of when sex took place is; subsequent poster originated, and deemed by original poster (me) to be irrelevant, (despite now echo from yourself).

2) Certainly agree that nervous sweat *in time* could also induce odors.

3) Please bear with me however, if I find your distinction between nervous, exertion or time allowed to remain on body in relation to origins of sweat odors another topic for discussion elsewhere.

4) The 'observation' about body odor that you requested, and I dutifully and innocently provided to you was solely to show that Amanda's alibi did not convince Polizia standing close to her that she had just showered.
Most others just looking at the picture, and without benefit of olfactory availability readily doubt the recent shower....which again is the point of this entire submission by me

5) See my introductory disclaimer about your reference to "murder as a stimulant"

PS:
The JREF Forum discusses for days and scores of pages the difference between lies and "internalized false admissions", 'imperfect recall', "misremembering", blah, blah.

An independent observer pointed out just days ago to them that such "quibbly dibble de doo" nonsense is the reason they have expended 27,000+ Posts and are still on square 1, and now without hardly any participation from other than the hard core blowhard egomaniac regurgitators.

Bottom line:
They said she stank and certainly did not look like she had just taken the shower she was probably therefore lying to them about.
[b]When or why
the stink originated is a consideration best saved or moved for JREF type 'circular activities'[/b]



A woman who has not showered after having sex retains the very strong and distinctive odor of semen for quite some time. I think the point being made by the officers who stood close to her and noticed this very distinctive smell is that it contradicted her claim that she had "just" taken a shower. The smell of stress, which varies from one person to the next depending on pheromones and surface bacteria on the skin, has a quite different smell that would not be mistaken for the smell of semen. I'm sure AK was quite stressed and that she exuded that odor too. It is different from sweat of exertion, which in turn is different from the smell of semen. At what point did AK become stressed? She said she was not alarmed by the open door, the blood, etc. RS stated that it was normal for Meredith to lock her door, and said he was quoting AK on that point. So this would not have stressed them out, though contradictorily they have alleged otherwise. AK called her mother, and then steadfastly refused to remember this call in spite of proof to the contrary. It all gets quite messy at this point.
I would be stressed too, just at the thought of having floated so many contradictory ideas in such a short span of time. Smelling like semen was the least of AK's problems by then. Maybe the cops were wrong. So what? They did not include it in their testimony, probably because it could not be demonstrated. It tallies with my own belief that AK did not go home to take a shower that morning and probably did not take one at the cottage. But I can't prove that and neither could the investigators. End of story, I think.



Do you know, I was quite looking forward to me dinner and now, strangely, I've gone right off it tu-))

Although it does remind me a of a joke: what is the difference between a lawyer and a sperm? A sperm has a 1 in 10,000 chance of becoming human.

:)

With apologies to my fellow brethren. sor-)

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What it is is spin lent credence because it's from the mouth of a lawyer. We've seen how much gravitas they can carry merely by saying something is or is not so when often they are speaking as much rubbish as anyone else.
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Offline Jools


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Location: Spain

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:08 pm   Post subject: Re: Buon Compleanno, Popper!   

The 411 wrote:
Today is Popper's Birthday!...


mul-)

Tanti auguri, Popper!!


HAPPY BIRTHDAY! pp-( pp-(
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Offline Jools


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:25 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

00Sneider wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
windfall wrote:
I assumed the pic at the bottom was of the actor playing Patrick, caption says Guede.



Yeah, so did I at first glance, no doubt because we're so used to that picture of Patrick. But I guess the beard and the bag (back from his travels?) make it Guede?


Yes, this must be Guede, because the cops around him wear german uniforms. Hence this probably is the moment, when he was arrested at Mainz or Koblenz.

You were right Sneider. It iss suppose to be Guede. Here is another picture that shows a sign outside police station that says Koblenz. The other pic is the actor playing Sollecito.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
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Offline bedelia


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:25 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina

bedelia wrote:

Regarding CBS- It's clear to me that because of David Marriott's credentials-he used to work at CBS- they are completely "owned" by him. Everything that comes out of there is completely slanted pro-Knox. But don't for a minute think that these people believe that Knox is the victim. To them it's just a story. 18 months ago, while watching the 48 hours video on You-tube, "An Innocent Abroad", I recognized the name of one of the editors. His daughter lives in the house behind us and is my daughter's best friend. His boss was Robert "Joe" Halderman. I approached him on the topic and asked him his opinion. His response, "She's got a lot of explaining to do." He clearly thought she was guilty. My take is this: these people are in show business, it's all about their careers and money. TV and film are extremely competitive. You get a job, you don't turn it down. The Kerchers are invisible to them; they don't realize the hurt that is being inflicted on them.


Joe Halderman and David Marriott are both former emmy-award winning journalists for CBS.
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:28 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

From the JREF:

London John wrote:
Ah yes, that's yet another piece of laughable pulled-out-of-thin-air nonsense from Fulcanelli. What happens if someone gets shot dead in a supermarket or restaurant in Italy? Do the police keep the supermarket or restaurant shut for a year and a half, with bloody belongings in the fresh fruit aisle or next to the dessert trolley? No: the police process the crime scene fully and quickly, then it is returned to its owners to be cleaned and returned to its regular function.

Sadly, some people often don't seem to know what they are talking about, and tend to invent or elaborate in order to attempt to shore up their position.


JREF


Perhaps London John, with his clearly superior knowledge to anyone else in regard to Italian police practice, can inform us all exactly why the police and Italian courts sealed the crime scene along with its contents for over a year if it was not to preserve said crime scene and contents?

While he's about it, he can also let us know when someone last got shot dead in his local supermarket. I would hazard, going out on a limb here, that people being shot dead in supermarkets is a rather uncommon event.

If they are shot dead in a restaurant, then the restaurant is also sealed. Has London John already forgotten the sealing of Patrick's bar for many months, and that wasn't even the murder scene, even though the vastly knowledgeable London John was speaking of it only a day or two ago? Apparently so.

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
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Offline bedelia


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:29 pm   Post subject: Re: Buon Compleanno, Popper!   

Jools wrote:
The 411 wrote:
Today is Popper's Birthday!...


mul-)

Tanti auguri, Popper!!


HAPPY BIRTHDAY! pp-( pp-(


Love the cork popping! Happy Birthday Popper! Thank you for all your informative posts! da-))
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Offline Corrina


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:32 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
Girlanda's book presentation is over. I think I can easily predict that this book will be one massive flop! Who on earth will spend money to read this piece of Kak!

Here is a first report with some more 'creative' kak from Knoxy:

Amanda: unpublished letters, ‘I wish I could sing to the wind’
October 26, 17:16

Rome- ''I wish so much to ‘sing’ always freely to the wind, but obviously a caged bird, is more restricted than a free bird, in singing too. Before the voice the wings have to arrive”: it is one of the passages from a letter, as yet unpublished, that Amanda Knox, who was sentenced in first instance to 26 years imprisonment for the murder of English student Meredith Kercher, wrote on August 18 last from the Perugia prison to the heads of the Italy-USA Foundation, who many times have gone to visit her in prison.

The letter and it was announced today in the Chamber during the presentation of the book "I'm coming with you - Conversations with Amanda Knox in jail" (Piemme pub.), of which the author is Rocco Girlanda, MP and president of Italy USA Foundation.

"The sun is just rising - Amanda writes from prison - and I am writing this under calm semidarkness, one of my favorite moments, because the world is still asleep, and like people, the world looks peaceful and evangelical while asleep.”

"Shalom," concludes Amanda, who under the signature contains a sentence that she writes very frequently, it comes from a song by Jovanotti: "I know I'm not alone even when I'm alone."
http://www.ansa.it/web/notizie/rubriche ... 36075.html
tu-))



How sweet. She's writing love letters to the Foundation. A caged bird is more restricted than a free bird. Brilliant. How does one go about looking evangelical?
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Offline Corrina


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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:20 pm

Posts: 625

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:37 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Hello there, Bedelia,

Yikes! How did I miss that? Thanks for re-posting that!

Popper, enjoy your day and do something kind for yourself.
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Offline 00Sneider


Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:01 am

Posts: 41

Location: Germany

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:40 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
00Sneider wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
windfall wrote:
I assumed the pic at the bottom was of the actor playing Patrick, caption says Guede.



Yeah, so did I at first glance, no doubt because we're so used to that picture of Patrick. But I guess the beard and the bag (back from his travels?) make it Guede?


Yes, this must be Guede, because the cops around him wear german uniforms. Hence this probably is the moment, when he was arrested at Mainz or Koblenz.

You were right Sneider. It iss suppose to be Guede. Here is another picture that shows a sign outside police station that says Koblenz. The other pic is the actor playing Sollecito.


It isn`t the police station, Hbf Koblenz stands for "Hauptbahnhof Koblenz", which in English means "central railway station Koblenz"
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Offline H9


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Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 12:37 am

Posts: 1716

Highscores: 161

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:46 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

No word yet on who is playing Meredith?

On set are the three main subjects of the story - Hayden Panettiere as Amanda Knox, Paolo Romio as Knox's boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito, and Djibril Kebe as Rudy Guede.


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Offline TomM


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Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:28 pm

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Location: California

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:51 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina wrote:
[*** How does one go about looking evangelical?

Dress conservatively and go door to door offering free copies of The Watchtower and a willingness to discuss salvation.
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:02 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

H9 wrote:
No word yet on who is playing Meredith?

On set are the three main subjects of the story - Hayden Panettiere as Amanda Knox, Paolo Romio as Knox's boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito, and Djibril Kebe as Rudy Guede.


Who's Meredith? It's clear they don't think Meredith is very important.

The characters of import for them and their precious film is, in the following order:

Amanda Knox
Edda Mellas
Raffaele Sollecito
Giuliano Mignini

The rest of the characters aren't considered important enough to even warrant a press release to say who's playing them. That says it all about this film and where it's going really.

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
PMF ON TWITTER
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Offline Corrina


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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:20 pm

Posts: 625

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:05 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

TomM wrote:
Corrina wrote:
[*** How does one go about looking evangelical?

Dress conservatively and go door to door offering free copies of The Watchtower and a willingness to discuss salvation.


NICE! cl-)
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Offline Clander


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Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:26 am

Posts: 855

Location: Rome

Highscores: 77

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:22 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
Girlanda's book presentation is over. I think I can easily predict that this book will be one massive flop! Who on earth will spend money to read this piece of Kak!

Here is a first report with some more 'creative' kak from Knoxy:

Amanda: unpublished letters, ‘I wish I could sing to the wind’
October 26, 17:16

Rome- ''I wish so much to ‘sing’ always freely to the wind, but obviously a caged bird, is more restricted than a free bird, in singing too. Before the voice the wings have to arrive”: it is one of the passages from a letter, as yet unpublished, that Amanda Knox, who was sentenced in first instance to 26 years imprisonment for the murder of English student Meredith Kercher, wrote on August 18 last from the Perugia prison to the heads of the Italy-USA Foundation, who many times have gone to visit her in prison.

The letter and it was announced today in the Chamber during the presentation of the book "I'm coming with you - Conversations with Amanda Knox in jail" (Piemme pub.), of which the author is Rocco Girlanda, MP and president of Italy USA Foundation.

"The sun is just rising - Amanda writes from prison - and I am writing this under calm semidarkness, one of my favorite moments, because the world is still asleep, and like people, the world looks peaceful and evangelical while asleep.”

"Shalom," concludes Amanda, who under the signature contains a sentence that she writes very frequently, it comes from a song by Jovanotti: "I know I'm not alone even when I'm alone."
http://www.ansa.it/web/notizie/rubriche ... 36075.html
tu-))


A copy of that email was surely given to the press before the presentation of the book since the presentation started at 17:30 and that email was read by Girlanda at around 18:15/18:20.
The presentation ended at 18:45.

Anyway, it's "calcetto night" and I must run.
I'll write a few thoughts on the presentation tomorrow.
Ciaoooooooooooooooooooooooo
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Offline Jools


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Location: Spain

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:31 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Solange305 wrote:
Oh my god, Im so sorry, but this shit was too funny not to post. Justinian's defense to AK's cartwheels in the police station:


Quote:
Furthermore, cartwheels are a great way to restore circulation - especially if feeling light-headed.


http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php?p= ... ount=12611

I heard sex is a great way to restore circulation as well, perhaps Amanda and Raff should have just done it right there in the Questura! Im sure Justinian would have found that reasonable as well, after all, it is a great stress reliever...


Well, they nearly did!!

According various witnesses testimony, while they were in the Questura waiting room in front of everyone, they were told off! And had to be reminded that the Questura was not the place for it. hump-)
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Offline Jools


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:34 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

00Sneider wrote:
Jools wrote:
00Sneider wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
windfall wrote:
I assumed the pic at the bottom was of the actor playing Patrick, caption says Guede.



Yeah, so did I at first glance, no doubt because we're so used to that picture of Patrick. But I guess the beard and the bag (back from his travels?) make it Guede?


Yes, this must be Guede, because the cops around him wear german uniforms. Hence this probably is the moment, when he was arrested at Mainz or Koblenz.

You were right Sneider. It iss suppose to be Guede. Here is another picture that shows a sign outside police station that says Koblenz. The other pic is the actor playing Sollecito.


It isn`t the police station, Hbf Koblenz stands for "Hauptbahnhof Koblenz", which in English means "central railway station Koblenz"

OK, thanks for the info.
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Offline Jools


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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:38 pm

Posts: 2241

Location: Spain

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:38 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The Machine wrote:
Cesare Beccaria has a new piece about Rocca Girlanda on TJMK:

http://www.truejustice.org/ee/index.php?/


This is a brilliant and factual piece!
th-)
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Offline Jools


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Posts: 2241

Location: Spain

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:43 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
Jools wrote:
Girlanda's book presentation is over. I think I can easily predict that this book will be one massive flop! Who on earth will spend money to read this piece of Kak!

Here is a first report with some more 'creative' kak from Knoxy:

Amanda: unpublished letters, ‘I wish I could sing to the wind’
October 26, 17:16

Rome- ''I wish so much to ‘sing’ always freely to the wind, but obviously a caged bird, is more restricted than a free bird, in singing too. Before the voice the wings have to arrive”: it is one of the passages from a letter, as yet unpublished, that Amanda Knox, who was sentenced in first instance to 26 years imprisonment for the murder of English student Meredith Kercher, wrote on August 18 last from the Perugia prison to the heads of the Italy-USA Foundation, who many times have gone to visit her in prison.

The letter and it was announced today in the Chamber during the presentation of the book "I'm coming with you - Conversations with Amanda Knox in jail" (Piemme pub.), of which the author is Rocco Girlanda, MP and president of Italy USA Foundation.

"The sun is just rising - Amanda writes from prison - and I am writing this under calm semidarkness, one of my favorite moments, because the world is still asleep, and like people, the world looks peaceful and evangelical while asleep.”

"Shalom," concludes Amanda, who under the signature contains a sentence that she writes very frequently, it comes from a song by Jovanotti: "I know I'm not alone even when I'm alone."
http://www.ansa.it/web/notizie/rubriche ... 36075.html
tu-))


A copy of that email was surely given to the press before the presentation of the book since the presentation started at 17:30 and that email was read by Girlanda at around 18:15/18:20.
The presentation ended at 18:45.

Anyway, it's "calcetto night" and I must run.
I'll write a few thoughts on the presentation tomorrow.
Ciaoooooooooooooooooooooooo


So, does this mean we can expect to see more of Knoxy's creative kak as other press may report of the book presentation? tu-))


Last edited by Jools on Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline stint7


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Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2009 8:07 pm

Posts: 1582

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 6:43 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
Solange305 wrote:
Oh my god, Im so sorry, but this shit was too funny not to post. Justinian's defense to AK's cartwheels in the police station:


Quote:
Furthermore, cartwheels are a great way to restore circulation - especially if feeling light-headed.


http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php?p= ... ount=12611

I heard sex is a great way to restore circulation as well, perhaps Amanda and Raff should have just done it right there in the Questura! Im sure Justinian would have found that reasonable as well, after all, it is a great stress reliever...


Well, they nearly did!!

According various witnesses testimony, while they were in the Questura waiting room in front of everyone, they were told off! And had to be reminded that the Questura was not the place for it. hump-)


Absolutely; the witness description of some of the 'quirky', inappropriate antics while in the Questura sounded to me to include Amanda giving Raffie a 'lap dance' ...with her feet.


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Offline DLW


Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2008 3:41 pm

Posts: 623

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 7:04 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Re: property claims for damages, and un paid rent.

A while back I recall reading that Rudy was being sued for several months (5 ?) rent by his landlady. A small claims court appearance was set. Biscotti, at the time, was trying to figure out where to get the necessary funds. If I had to guess I’d say that Raff’s Dad quietly paid his landlord off. If anything I’d think that Amanda wants compensated for additional living expenses during the investigation . She was probably willing to move back to the cottage the next night. Sounds like Long John would agree with that also. If her appeals fail, I’m sure it’s going to be on her tab. If exonerated than I guess its on the States tab along with 3 yrs false imprisonment.

From NowItaly.com: ‘A new book of conversations and letters presented here Tuesday reveals some of the frustrations Amanda Knox is experiencing in jail after being convicted of the murder of British exchange student Meredith Kercher.’

Just can’t make this stuff up. Is Rocco (The Rock) Girlanda setting himself up as a soft porn writer. Does Rocco (along with the Angelic one) get free advertisement for his/their literary skills, and then his supporters and special interest foundation/lobby’s have to buy his/their book.

Happy birthday Popper
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Offline Corrina


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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:20 pm

Posts: 625

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 7:04 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Come on, Stint. You know very well that Amanda was just stretching her feet after standing all day and one of the policeman asked her what else she could do with her feet.
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Offline Earthling


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Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2009 8:25 pm

Posts: 504

Location: USA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 7:13 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
From the JREF:

London John wrote:
Ah yes, that's yet another piece of laughable pulled-out-of-thin-air nonsense from Fulcanelli. What happens if someone gets shot dead in a supermarket or restaurant in Italy? Do the police keep the supermarket or restaurant shut for a year and a half, with bloody belongings in the fresh fruit aisle or next to the dessert trolley? No: the police process the crime scene fully and quickly, then it is returned to its owners to be cleaned and returned to its regular function.

Sadly, some people often don't seem to know what they are talking about, and tend to invent or elaborate in order to attempt to shore up their position.


JREF


Perhaps London John, with his clearly superior knowledge to anyone else in regard to Italian police practice, can inform us all exactly why the police and Italian courts sealed the crime scene along with its contents for over a year if it was not to preserve said crime scene and contents?

While he's about it, he can also let us know when someone last got shot dead in his local supermarket. I would hazard, going out on a limb here, that people being shot dead in supermarkets is a rather uncommon event.

If they are shot dead in a restaurant, then the restaurant is also sealed. Has London John already forgotten the sealing of Patrick's bar for many months, and that wasn't even the murder scene, even though the vastly knowledgeable London John was speaking of it only a day or two ago? Apparently so.

Sadly, LooneyJohn is doing exactly in his first paragraph, what he is denouncing in his second.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Michael clearly wasn't talking about a murder in a venue such that the venue played little to no part in the crime. But of course, that straw man is so much easier for JohnBoy Looney Loon-Johnny Longlegs to bash in.


Last edited by Earthling on Tue Oct 26, 2010 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Earthling


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Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2009 8:25 pm

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Location: USA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 7:17 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
"Shalom," concludes Amanda, who under the signature contains a sentence that she writes very frequently, it comes from a song by Jovanotti: "I know I'm not alone even when I'm alone."

Does she mean the ghost of Meredith haunts her?
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Offline tom_ch


Joined: Sat Dec 12, 2009 7:40 am

Posts: 241

Location: CH

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 7:26 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Earthling wrote:
Jools wrote:
"Shalom," concludes Amanda, who under the signature contains a sentence that she writes very frequently, it comes from a song by Jovanotti: "I know I'm not alone even when I'm alone."

Does she mean the ghost of Meredith haunts her?

Perhaps we should ask Lorenzo?

Tom
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Offline Michael

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Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 7:06 pm

Posts: 16732

Location: England

Highscores: 113

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 7:43 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Earthling wrote:
Michael wrote:
From the JREF:

London John wrote:
Ah yes, that's yet another piece of laughable pulled-out-of-thin-air nonsense from Fulcanelli. What happens if someone gets shot dead in a supermarket or restaurant in Italy? Do the police keep the supermarket or restaurant shut for a year and a half, with bloody belongings in the fresh fruit aisle or next to the dessert trolley? No: the police process the crime scene fully and quickly, then it is returned to its owners to be cleaned and returned to its regular function.

Sadly, some people often don't seem to know what they are talking about, and tend to invent or elaborate in order to attempt to shore up their position.


JREF


Perhaps London John, with his clearly superior knowledge to anyone else in regard to Italian police practice, can inform us all exactly why the police and Italian courts sealed the crime scene along with its contents for over a year if it was not to preserve said crime scene and contents?

While he's about it, he can also let us know when someone last got shot dead in his local supermarket. I would hazard, going out on a limb here, that people being shot dead in supermarkets is a rather uncommon event.

If they are shot dead in a restaurant, then the restaurant is also sealed. Has London John already forgotten the sealing of Patrick's bar for many months, and that wasn't even the murder scene, even though the vastly knowledgeable London John was speaking of it only a day or two ago? Apparently so.

Sadly, LooneyJohn is doing exactly in his first paragraph, what he is denouncing in his second.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

Michael clearly wasn't talking about a murder in a venue such that the venue played little to no part in the crime. But of course, that straw man is so much easier for JohnBoy Looney Loon-Johnny Longlegs to bash in.



And he STILL hasn't told us how many people have been murdered in his local supermarket lately :)

Neither has he told us WHY the cottage was sealed for over a year, having claimed the reason I had given for it was incorrect.

At the moment he's having a tantrum and busying himself making stupid arguments about Mafia murders in bars and restaurants (no supermarkets though ;) )...completely missing the point that those bars and restaurants would have been sealed for many months also. There is nothing unusual in Italy about the cottage and Patrick's bar and contents being sealed for many months. It's SOP. That doesn't stop idiot John claiming the sealing of Patrick's bar was "unlawful" (without cites of course). This is despite the fact that neither Patrick, his lawyers or the courts seemed to think so, but as we know....London John knows best ;)

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
PMF ON TWITTER
PMF FORUM RULES
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Offline Earthling


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Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2009 8:25 pm

Posts: 504

Location: USA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 8:16 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

tom_ch wrote:
Earthling wrote:
Jools wrote:
"Shalom," concludes Amanda, who under the signature contains a sentence that she writes very frequently, it comes from a song by Jovanotti: "I know I'm not alone even when I'm alone."

Does she mean the ghost of Meredith haunts her?

Perhaps we should ask Lorenzo?

Tom

Who's Lorenzo, please? Am I missing something? is)
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Offline stilicho


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Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 2:24 am

Posts: 2492

Location: Western Canada

Highscores: 8

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 8:24 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
From the JREF:

London John wrote:
Ah yes, that's yet another piece of laughable pulled-out-of-thin-air nonsense from Fulcanelli. What happens if someone gets shot dead in a supermarket or restaurant in Italy? Do the police keep the supermarket or restaurant shut for a year and a half, with bloody belongings in the fresh fruit aisle or next to the dessert trolley? No: the police process the crime scene fully and quickly, then it is returned to its owners to be cleaned and returned to its regular function.

Sadly, some people often don't seem to know what they are talking about, and tend to invent or elaborate in order to attempt to shore up their position.


JREF


Perhaps London John, with his clearly superior knowledge to anyone else in regard to Italian police practice, can inform us all exactly why the police and Italian courts sealed the crime scene along with its contents for over a year if it was not to preserve said crime scene and contents?

While he's about it, he can also let us know when someone last got shot dead in his local supermarket. I would hazard, going out on a limb here, that people being shot dead in supermarkets is a rather uncommon event.

If they are shot dead in a restaurant, then the restaurant is also sealed. Has London John already forgotten the sealing of Patrick's bar for many months, and that wasn't even the murder scene, even though the vastly knowledgeable London John was speaking of it only a day or two ago? Apparently so.


First--Happy Birthday Popper! (The important things always get first nod).

My answer to LooneyJohn would be: "So what?"

I, too, think that police investigators should be accurate and timely in collecting evidence and nobody should be inconvenienced when a murder takes place on their property without their knowledge. But what bearing can this possibly have on the outcome of the trial and the appeals?

The appeals (from what I know) care only in arguing contamination and not that the cottage was kept from its owner too long.

The groupies must seriously have run out of ideas to keep their dying "cause" alive. If LooneyJohn, Rose, and Katy really want to do us a favour maybe they could find out just what happened at Heather's Columbus OH "benefit" that featured two bands so obscure they can't even be found on the internet.
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Offline Popper


Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 10:36 am

Posts: 266

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 8:30 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks a lot again
you are all too kind
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2008 5:36 pm

Posts: 7006

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 8:33 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stilicho wrote:
Michael wrote:
From the JREF:

London John wrote:
Ah yes, that's yet another piece of laughable pulled-out-of-thin-air nonsense from Fulcanelli. What happens if someone gets shot dead in a supermarket or restaurant in Italy? Do the police keep the supermarket or restaurant shut for a year and a half, with bloody belongings in the fresh fruit aisle or next to the dessert trolley? No: the police process the crime scene fully and quickly, then it is returned to its owners to be cleaned and returned to its regular function.

Sadly, some people often don't seem to know what they are talking about, and tend to invent or elaborate in order to attempt to shore up their position.


JREF


Perhaps London John, with his clearly superior knowledge to anyone else in regard to Italian police practice, can inform us all exactly why the police and Italian courts sealed the crime scene along with its contents for over a year if it was not to preserve said crime scene and contents?

While he's about it, he can also let us know when someone last got shot dead in his local supermarket. I would hazard, going out on a limb here, that people being shot dead in supermarkets is a rather uncommon event.

If they are shot dead in a restaurant, then the restaurant is also sealed. Has London John already forgotten the sealing of Patrick's bar for many months, and that wasn't even the murder scene, even though the vastly knowledgeable London John was speaking of it only a day or two ago? Apparently so.


First--Happy Birthday Popper! (The important things always get first nod).

My answer to LooneyJohn would be: "So what?"

I, too, think that police investigators should be accurate and timely in collecting evidence and nobody should be inconvenienced when a murder takes place on their property without their knowledge. But what bearing can this possibly have on the outcome of the trial and the appeals?

The appeals (from what I know) care only in arguing contamination and not that the cottage was kept from its owner too long.

The groupies must seriously have run out of ideas to keep their dying "cause" alive. If LooneyJohn, Rose, and Katy really want to do us a favour maybe they could find out just what happened at Heather's Columbus OH "benefit" that featured two bands so obscure they can't even be found on the internet.


I would take it one step farther and not answer Loony Tunes at all. From what I have heard, it only provokes more verbiage with no bearing on anything at all.
As for the two recent fundraising efforts, I think it is safe to say that the Ohio gig was a bust and the West Seattle gig was a release party for Girlanda's book in disguise. I did not hear or read any reports of crowds spilling onto the sidewalk in front of the rather tiny Shadowland bar. Twenty bucks is a pretty steep cover charge for that venue, by the way. The one poster advertising it is still up, as I noted, kind of lost among the many other posters hawking many other causes and miracle cures.

_________________
Le coeur a ses raisons que la raison ne connait point; on le sait en mille choses.
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Offline The Machine


Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:43 pm

Posts: 2306

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:09 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
but as we know....London John knows best ;)


I wonder if Looney John is schizophrenic. Here are some of his comments from PMF:

"Regardless of my view about AK's interview, I believe that other evidence shows her guilt"

"My opinion is that AK and RS planned to fully clean the whole cottage, and that the reason there was so much damning blood evidence in the bathroom (who would leave a bloody footprint - almost certainly RS's - on the bathmat?!) and in the luminol-traced footprints, is that they logically planned to disinfect the bathroom as the final act in the clean-up."

"In line with this, I believe that the reason that Filomena's room was chosen for the fake break-in (despite the near-impossibility of anyone being able to scale the outside wall) was that the plan was for Filomena (or maybe Laura) to discover the whole horrible scene upon returning from their parents' houses."

"I think that they had only just broken the window when they saw - to their horror - a police car arrive outside the house and two uniformed officers approach the door."

"It should be obvious that I'm a firm "guilter", prejudiced as I am towards scientific analysis, circumstantial evidence, and logical inference hehe"

"Incidentally, if AK really HAD called F at 12.07pm in genuine worry about the house and suspected break in (and possible greater foul play), wouldn't she have logically called Laura directly afterwards too, if only to tell her to come back to the flat to see if any of her stuff had been stolen etc...?"

He has certainly changed his tune since he left PMF.
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Offline Michael

Site Admin


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Posts: 16732

Location: England

Highscores: 113

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:40 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Meanwhile, he's posting up murders in supermarkets, although not one of them is his local supermarket and none of them are Italian supermarkets. It does not effect my statement that murders in supermarkets are not a common event :)

And for the record had the murder have taken place in the Conad supermarket rather then the cottage, that would have been sealed too.

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:44 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

TM wrote:
He has certainly changed his tune since he left PMF.


His tune changed practically the moment he left PMF...and that's because he's a slimy little weasel.

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:44 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I'm looking forward to your gem, Machine.

There is a female called Manda,
Who is waiting her trial for slander,
She's in prison for killing
And wants to go *hilling*
But she better not count on Clander.

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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:11 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!

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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:17 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
TM wrote:
He has certainly changed his tune since he left PMF.


His tune changed practically the moment he left PMF...and that's because he's a slimy little weasel.

I didn't realize he had a history here at PMF until last week's kerfluffle, when I went back and read his posts here from last spring. Needless to say, having only known of him from his JREF activity, I was amazed to see his self-presentation, then, as a "firm guilter."

I believe that he really does know that the lovebirds are guilty. I highly doubt that in the past few months he's had a "Road to Damascus conversion"; I think that it's merely that it doesn't matter to him if they're guilty.... as long as he can show (to the satisfaction of his own fevered brain) they shouldn't have been convicted.

He says as much himself: "My heightened interest in this case started when I began to believe that they were wrongly convicted - not when I began to believe that they might actually be non-culpable. And I'd still have been interested in commenting on my belief in a wrongful conviction, even if I was still unsure as to whether Knox and/or Sollecito were actually involved in the crime."

Loony Tunes Johnny Longlegs really needs a reality check. But I'm pretty much done with him, and that thread. It's a time-waster and a pointless exercise in sophistry. Maybe I'll post the odd post now and then. I admire anyone who can stomach it for longer stretches but not me, no-sirree.

You know the way we can really annoy Johnny Appleseed Longjohns? Just stop mentioning him completely. I think it's what he deserves. He has shown himself, over and over, as a sophist of the highest order.

Maybe we could get the Queen to award him Chief Sophist of the British Empire. That would be so fitting.

So, LoooooongWinded JohnnyBoy, here it is:
Attachment:
225px-Ster_Orde_van_het_Britse_Rijk.jpg

And now, I'm done with you.

Oh, and Happy Birthday Popper!!!! dm-)


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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:19 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!

Great minds think alike! I was just posting how I'm done with him. mop-)
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:26 pm   Post subject: Words of Wind Wisdom   

Jools wrote:

Amanda: unpublished letters, ‘I wish I could sing to the wind’
October 26, 17:16




Do anyone know if they have Bibles in Campanne? If not, I may send AK one with certain helpful Scripture verses underlined.

I hate to get all Evangelical on y'all but...speaking of wind (the meteorological kind)....
Manders should be reminded that:

"He who brings trouble on his family will inherit only wind, and the fool will be servant to the wise." nnn-))
--Proverbs 11:29
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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:37 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stint7 wrote:
OT....OT

You deserve a break today: Watch a minute of two cats playing 'patty-cake


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvxCv_yr ... r_embedded

Thanks, stint, that was soooooo cute!!!! da-))

In turn, I present:

OT OT OT

Nature had a wonderful show on crows the other night. I didn't realize how intelligent these birds are. They can recognize specific people, and teach their young to avoid certain people.

Also, New Caledonian crows are one of only about three species (chimps and us are the only others, I believe) who MAKE tools.

This stuff is incredible. Here's a link to the Nature program (full episode online, highly recommended):
http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/episodes ... sode/5977/

Here's an article about the same subject:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/earth/hi/earth_ne ... 125227.stm
In this article, there's a video embedded that shows a short clip of the New Caledonian crow using one tool, to get another tool, which he then uses to get at some food. ... incredible.

And I guess the BBC also has a segment on crows here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/nature/adaptations ... s#p00bt2kq

One point of the article above, is that these crows raise their young for several years in small groups, and send their young to a sort of "school" to learn how to use tools.


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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:38 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Amanda Knox lawyer bars meeting with Panettiere

By Sophie Taylor LAST UPDATED 9:17 AM, OCTOBER 26, 2010


Quote:
A Hollywood insider said: "Lifetime [the channel that has commissioned the film] appear to be extraordinarily confident that Amanda will lose her appeal."



THE FIRST POST

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Offline DJLawless


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:44 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
I'm looking forward to your gem, Machine.

There is a female called Manda,
Who is waiting her trial for slander,
She's in prison for killing
And wants to go *hilling*
But she better not count on Clander.


:lol: cl-) tt-)

Hello Cape!!! How are you doing!!!

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:46 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!



SA, I thought a few days ago I told you "why".

And in this particular case idiot John and his followers are smearing Italian police SOP to such an extent any neutral reader who is unaware of how Italian crimes are investigated and why it is done so, would be under the impression that the police did something particularly wrong when that is not the case. I consider that important. That kind of misinformation needs to be addressed. And for reasons I also explained a few days ago, it's better to address them here...then there.

If you don't like it SA, just use your scroll bar.

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:55 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Earthling wrote:
I believe that he really does know that the lovebirds are guilty. I highly doubt that in the past few months he's had a "Road to Damascus conversion"; I think that it's merely that it doesn't matter to him if they're guilty.... as long as he can show (to the satisfaction of his own fevered brain) they shouldn't have been convicted.


Oh, he's openly said on plenty of occasions they probably did do it, but they should be acquitted anyway. In his view, even if they did it, if their guilt is not proven beyond a reasonable doubt to 'his' arbitrary standard and they went down for it that would be an injustice. Whether they actually did it or not is not really important to him.

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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:05 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!



SA, I thought a few days ago I told you "why".

And in this particular case idiot John and his followers are smearing Italian police SOP to such an extent any neutral reader who is unaware of how Italian crimes are investigated and why it is done so, would be under the impression that the police did something particularly wrong when that is not the case. I consider that important. That kind of misinformation needs to be addressed. And for reasons I also explained a few days ago, it's better to address them here...then there.

If you don't like it SA, just use your scroll bar.



I think neutral is the wrong word. The words you want are uninformed and easily swayed. I agree with SA at the end of the day. LJ is not worth bothering with and neither is that particularly sorry JREF discussion. Everything I have seen reported here is too ludicrous to be taken seriously. LJ and Co. may have tons of time on their hands, but that is no reason to give them more.

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Offline stint7


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:19 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!

I consider that important. That kind of misinformation needs to be addressed. And for reasons I also explained a few days ago, it's better to address them here...then there.


FWIW...
I stand strongly with Michael on this one.


SA's point, as always has some merit. For his and other's wishes, I personally have cut down on re posting here some of the just plain stupid things some of the less prolific Dunces over there spit out.

But more to the point, Loonatic (sp) J. can barely pass an hour without vomiting up one of his customary characteristically slimy slurs against PMF or people here, or arrogant disrespect to the Kerchers.

His statements are often so blatantly full of unadulterated BULLSHIT that I often wonder how even his butt kissing, back slapping, peon buddies over there even can in good conscience let them go unchallenged.

Ignoring such abuse as this is not IMHO an option.

Pointing out his disingenuous pious pontifications, outright lies, and spin doctor extraordinaire misrepresentations of everything about himself and particularly the case, is really part of the reason PMF was founded for.

He monitors every word said here almost before posters hit submit.
Comments here are effective 'truth squads' constraints for him and he knows it.

He commented on Machines beautiful expose of what a turncoat liar he was here and still is there, within minutes of it going up here...snidely as usual saying he can't understand why anyone would use 'valuable time' researching what he said here.

Kudos to Michael for not letting him run us and the facts of the case amuck ad infinitum.

Unanswered and ignored, just conveys assent and correctness to impaired minds such as his and his sorry ilk.

Just my opinion, humbly proffered


Last edited by stint7 on Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:20 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

So, a quick recap. Amanda has gone from : * The NAZI within* to SHALOM. From being agnostic..to EVANGELICAL!!! Is there no end to this manipulative bitch?????????????/

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:22 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Skeptical Bystander wrote:
Michael wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!



SA, I thought a few days ago I told you "why".

And in this particular case idiot John and his followers are smearing Italian police SOP to such an extent any neutral reader who is unaware of how Italian crimes are investigated and why it is done so, would be under the impression that the police did something particularly wrong when that is not the case. I consider that important. That kind of misinformation needs to be addressed. And for reasons I also explained a few days ago, it's better to address them here...then there.

If you don't like it SA, just use your scroll bar.



I think neutral is the wrong word. The words you want are uninformed and easily swayed. I agree with SA at the end of the day. LJ is not worth bothering with and neither is that particularly sorry JREF discussion. Everything I have seen reported here is too ludicrous to be taken seriously. LJ and Co. may have tons of time on their hands, but that is no reason to give them more.



Well...I'll tell you something. It isn't only the 'neutrals' on the JREF. I said a few days ago PMF is not an island. However, neither is the JREF. When they create a misinformation construct that goes unchallenged they think they have something that sticks, a new talking point, and when that happens it doesn't stay on the JREF. It gets taken and spread around like a virus on various news articles comments sections all over the web which are read by a broader public largely ignorant of the details of this case and the way the ILE do things. That for me, is why it needs to be nipped in the bud at source before it starts growing roots.

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:26 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Hi, DJ, Quite furious, actually. It's stomach churning, is what it is. However, it is an interesting view into a pyscopath's mind. If I could, I would call her corny. However, I would find it frightening if anyone puts any credence to this cretin. But, thanks for asking, Hon.

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:29 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Stint, It's quite simple really, Imo. Looongjohn wanted to be the MAIN poster on this board. He was rightly banned. So, in his simple mind, change from guilter to innocenter, and run the other's side thread. AS LONG AS HE'S IN PRINT, A LOT, and able to show his..cough...brilliance...

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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:34 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:
Michael wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!



SA, I thought a few days ago I told you "why".

And in this particular case idiot John and his followers are smearing Italian police SOP to such an extent any neutral reader who is unaware of how Italian crimes are investigated and why it is done so, would be under the impression that the police did something particularly wrong when that is not the case. I consider that important. That kind of misinformation needs to be addressed. And for reasons I also explained a few days ago, it's better to address them here...then there.

If you don't like it SA, just use your scroll bar.



I think neutral is the wrong word. The words you want are uninformed and easily swayed. I agree with SA at the end of the day. LJ is not worth bothering with and neither is that particularly sorry JREF discussion. Everything I have seen reported here is too ludicrous to be taken seriously. LJ and Co. may have tons of time on their hands, but that is no reason to give them more.



Well...I'll tell you something. It isn't only the 'neutrals' on the JREF. I said a few days ago PMF is not an island. However, neither is the JREF. When they create a misinformation construct that goes unchallenged they think they have something that sticks, a new talking point, and when that happens it doesn't stay on the JREF. It gets taken and spread around like a virus on various news articles comments sections all over the web which are read by a broader public largely ignorant of the details of this case and the way the ILE do things. That for me, is why it needs to be nipped in the bud at source before it starts growing roots.




Well, look, my point is that you posted a heart-felt piece the other day about how you weren't going to get drawn into JREF Amanda-apologist crap any more and encouraged others not to. This post of LJ, to me, looks like grade A crap - there's no validity to it, no cite, no reason, no reasoning and it utterly doesn't stand up. I can't think of a more stark example of the very stuff you said you were going to avoid than this, and no I don't think it, in any way, starts some new reasoning that has to be battered down; it's just everyday normal bullshit.

I do appreciate you consider me a pain in the tits. That's just life. I'm also in the habit of trying to point out to my friends when they are chasing their own tails. God knows I need my own mates to help me point that out when I am doing the very same. I can scroll and I REALLY don't mind what you post ex ante because I am not in a position, nor would I ever want to be, to dictate people's personal choice - it's your choice of course. But I'm just responding to your own heart-felt words and you look and sound like, to me, like posters who have sworn off the booze and grabbed the first spritzer you can see!!! :) I was trying to help you see that is all.

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Offline Jools


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:37 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
So, a quick recap. Amanda has gone from : * The NAZI within* to SHALOM. From being agnostic..to EVANGELICAL!!! Is there no end to this manipulative bitch?????????????/

It seems not. Here is another piece of her creative Kak she wrote for Girlanda's book.
My translation. Enjoy! br-))


**I'd like to share my eyes with everyone - this explains the big and very expensive digital photo camera that I carry hanging from my neck. The best thing would be to wear a pair of glasses with built-in video camera, so it can record in real time everything I see. But I have two objections on this matter. The first is that I like that what I see creates a sort of unique and special relationship between myself and the rest of the world. The second is that I think that in my case a movie would be less incisive than a photograph. Something happens when you point the camera, you focus and you capture just one instant, as if it were the only one. The image is transformed into something universally understandable, extracted from the rest and lost forever. I've never tried to shoot movies, I think it requires a different mentality from mine. I don’t perceive my experiences like a flow of images that run in real time, but like a sequence of single shots. Linking my experiences with the passage of time seems to me an artificial mechanism, a concept superimposed to the images, instead of intrinsic. In other words, all my experiences could be reorganized also in a different order. And this would mean that also I would be a different person, because the person like the concept is inherited in the sequence and not just in the experiences themselves. I feel constantly the sensation that I could easily be someone else, it would be enough to throw in the air all the photos I took and re arrange them at random. I could be a different person. Instead no. It's me.

A chick ...
Butterfly Quiver-
Frozen spots –
Trinkets wrapped in cotton wool –
Soft air –
The nose of a snowman –
A velvety cheek –
The dizziness –
Evanescence –
Nudity –
**********
:roll:


Last edited by Jools on Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:37 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
Stint, It's quite simple really, Imo. Looongjohn wanted to be the MAIN poster on this board. He was rightly banned. So, in his simple mind, change from guilter to innocenter, and run the other's side thread. AS LONG AS HE'S IN PRINT, A LOT, and able to show his..cough...brilliance...


I think you have it Cape. He's a blow hard desperate for a captive audience. He wants a stage, not a cause.

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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:50 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:


**I'd like to share my eyes with everyone - this explains the big and very expensive digital photo camera that I carry hanging from my neck. The best thing would be to wear a pair of glasses with built-in video camera, so it can record in real time everything I see. But I have two objections on this matter. The first is that I like that what I see creates a sort of unique and special relationship between myself and the rest of the world. The second is that I think that in my case a movie would be less incisive than a photograph. Something happens when you point the camera, you focus and you capture just one instant, as if it were the only one. The image is transformed into something universally understandable, extracted from the rest and lost forever. I've never tried to shoot movies, I think it requires a different mentality from mine. I don’t perceive my experiences like a flow of images that run in real time, but like a sequence of single shots. Linking my experiences with the passage of time seems to me an artificial mechanism, a concept superimposed to the images, instead of intrinsic. In other words, all my experiences could be reorganized also in a different order. And this would mean that also I would be a different person, because the person like the concept is inherited in the sequence and not just in the experiences themselves. I feel constantly the sensation that I could easily be someone else, it would be enough to throw in the air all the photos I took and re arrange them at random. I could be a different person. Instead no. It's me.

A chick ...
Butterfly Quiver-
Frozen spots –
Trinkets wrapped in cotton wool –
Soft air –
The nose of a snowman –
A velvety cheek –
The dizziness –
Evanescence –
Nudity –
**********


You are absolutely kidding me? I'm so sorry to do this to such a highly respected poster but you are saying that is a direct posting of her words - all of the above? Seriously?

I am, no comedy involved, radically re-evaluating my view on Knox this evening if this is from her hand. Seriously. Probably the biggest wow in a long time.

_________________
What it is is spin lent credence because it's from the mouth of a lawyer. We've seen how much gravitas they can carry merely by saying something is or is not so when often they are speaking as much rubbish as anyone else.


Last edited by SomeAlibi on Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline stint7


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:52 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
and you look and sound like, to me, like posters who have sworn off the booze and grabbed the first spritzer you can see!!! :)


Not to inject myself into words meant for Michael, but I find it hard to swallow the booze- spritzer analogy.

PMF Posters stopped posting there partly because in so doing, they have caused the Thread to shrink to a skeletal comical crew of like minded blowhards telling each other how great their arguments are.

Even fellow JREF members from other threads are now mocking what 'skeptical' content is there in a 27,000 post thread still arguing square 1 in yet another spin off thread.
http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php? ... ost6482097

May I humbly offer that holding L.J.'s (overly self contemplated) toes and feet to the fire when he blatantly promulgates BullShit that others then utilize as a force multiplier is a very, very far cry from 'grabbing spritzers'


Last edited by stint7 on Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:54 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stint7 wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
and you look and sound like, to me, like posters who have sworn off the booze and grabbed the first spritzer you can see!!! :)


Not to inject myself into words meant for Michael, but I find it hard to swallow the booze- spritzer 'jury pleasing' analogy.

PMF Posters stopped posting there partly because in so doing, they have caused the Thread to shrink to a skeletal comical crew of like minded blowhards telling each other how great their arguments are.

Even fellow JREF members from other threads are now mocking what 'skeptical' content is there in a 27,000 post thread still arguing square 1 in yet another spin off thread.
http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php? ... ost6482097

May I humbly offer that holding L.J.'s (overly self contemplated) toes and feet to the fire when he blatantly promulgates BullShit that others then utilize as a force multiplier is a very, very far cry from 'grabbing spritzers'



I'm not trying to please a jury Stint, I'm talking with a subjective voice. I don't speak for anyone else. Ever. There's no point in swearing off JREF if you're going to post back on shit like LJ's. Feel free to disagree with me of course. It's purely subjective.

Fairly mad about the jury-pleasing dig. Counting to ten. I don't think we need that in here please.

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:58 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Err, Jools. Thank You? I need to ask you, while you were translating, was there a need for a large bottle of wine? Something stronger?? I take from *this* , that Amanda would rather be someone else. I'm afraid she's caught the google bug. The spelling has improved. The thought process, is, as usual, a puddle of mud. Just reading that, was a STRAIN!!! She honestly does not know who she os. Jump from velvety, to frozen. A snowman's nose to dizzy. I feel dizzy just trying to figure out what she's trying to say. Whatever Looongjohn has, Amanda has caught it. And, they're both not well.

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Offline Jools


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:02 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Jools wrote:


**I'd like to share my eyes with everyone - this explains the big and very expensive digital photo camera that I carry hanging from my neck. The best thing would be to wear a pair of glasses with built-in video camera, so it can record in real time everything I see. But I have two objections on this matter. The first is that I like that what I see creates a sort of unique and special relationship between myself and the rest of the world. The second is that I think that in my case a movie would be less incisive than a photograph. Something happens when you point the camera, you focus and you capture just one instant, as if it were the only one. The image is transformed into something universally understandable, extracted from the rest and lost forever. I've never tried to shoot movies, I think it requires a different mentality from mine. I don’t perceive my experiences like a flow of images that run in real time, but like a sequence of single shots. Linking my experiences with the passage of time seems to me an artificial mechanism, a concept superimposed to the images, instead of intrinsic. In other words, all my experiences could be reorganized also in a different order. And this would mean that also I would be a different person, because the person like the concept is inherited in the sequence and not just in the experiences themselves. I feel constantly the sensation that I could easily be someone else, it would be enough to throw in the air all the photos I took and re arrange them at random. I could be a different person. Instead no. It's me.

A chick ...
Butterfly Quiver-
Frozen spots –
Trinkets wrapped in cotton wool –
Soft air –
The nose of a snowman –
A velvety cheek –
The dizziness –
Evanescence –
Nudity –
**********


You are absolutely kidding me? I'm so sorry to do this to such a highly respected poster but you are saying that is a direct posting of her words - all of the above? Seriously?

I am, no comedy involved, radically re-evaluating my view on Knox this evening if this is from her hand. Seriously. Probably the biggest wow in a long time.

:lol: Yes, page 17 and part of page 18 of Girlanda's book "I'm coming with you". There is more coming if I can get the time to translate.

Here is the actual text of the above in Italian in case any one else want to go through my translation.

Quote:
Mi piacerebbe poter condividere i miei occhi con tut- ti – questo spiega la grande e costosa macchina fotogra- fica digitale che porto appesa al collo. La cosa migliore sarebbe indossare un paio di occhiali con videocamera incorporata, così da poter registrare in tempo reale tutto quello che vedo. Ma avrei due obiezioni in proposito. La prima è che mi piace che quello che vedo crei una sorta di relazione unica e speciale fra me e il resto del mondo. La seconda è che penso che nel mio caso un filmato sa- rebbe meno incisivo di una fotografia. Accade qualcosa quando punti la macchina fotografica, metti a fuoco e catturi un solo istante, come se fosse l’unico. L’immagine si trasforma in qualcosa di universalmente comprensibi- le, estrapolato da tutto il resto e perso per sempre. Non ho mai provato a girare dei filmati, penso che occorra una mentalità diversa dalla mia. Io non percepisco le mie esperienze come un flusso di immagini che scorrono in tempo reale, ma come una sequenza di scatti singoli. Le- gare le mie esperienze allo scorrere del tempo mi sembra un meccanismo artificiale, un significato sovrapposto alle immagini, invece che intrinseco. In altre parole, tut- te le mie esperienze potrebbero venire riorganizzate an- che in un ordine diverso. E questo significherebbe che anche io sarei una persona diversa, perché la persona, come il significato, è connaturata nella sequenza e non solo nelle esperienze stesse. Provo costantemente la sen- sazione che potrei facilmente essere qualcun altro, baste- rebbe gettare in aria tutte le fotografie che ho scattato e riordinarle a caso. Potrei essere una persona diversa. Invece no. Sono io.
Un pulcino... Fremito di farfalle – Macchie congelate – Ninnoli racchiusi in batuffoli di cotone – Aria tenera – Il naso di un pupazzo di neve – Una guancia vellutata – Le vertigini – Evanescenza – Nudità –

:lol:
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:03 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I don't know, Some Alibi. Amanda may have copied something, but doesn't have a grasp of UNDERSTANDING what is on paper. Her, sort of poem, is like the Manders we know . Really doesn't know whether she's Arthur or martha. But for sure, doesn't want to be who she is.

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:04 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Michael wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:
Michael wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Guys (n possibly girls) I know I'm a monumental pain in the butt but why exactly are you posting stuff about LoonyJ? He's risible and ridiculous but I can't think of a more stark example of the shit you said you weren't going to participate in or respond to any more on JREF? He's EXACTLY it!



SA, I thought a few days ago I told you "why".

And in this particular case idiot John and his followers are smearing Italian police SOP to such an extent any neutral reader who is unaware of how Italian crimes are investigated and why it is done so, would be under the impression that the police did something particularly wrong when that is not the case. I consider that important. That kind of misinformation needs to be addressed. And for reasons I also explained a few days ago, it's better to address them here...then there.

If you don't like it SA, just use your scroll bar.



I think neutral is the wrong word. The words you want are uninformed and easily swayed. I agree with SA at the end of the day. LJ is not worth bothering with and neither is that particularly sorry JREF discussion. Everything I have seen reported here is too ludicrous to be taken seriously. LJ and Co. may have tons of time on their hands, but that is no reason to give them more.



Well...I'll tell you something. It isn't only the 'neutrals' on the JREF. I said a few days ago PMF is not an island. However, neither is the JREF. When they create a misinformation construct that goes unchallenged they think they have something that sticks, a new talking point, and when that happens it doesn't stay on the JREF. It gets taken and spread around like a virus on various news articles comments sections all over the web which are read by a broader public largely ignorant of the details of this case and the way the ILE do things. That for me, is why it needs to be nipped in the bud at source before it starts growing roots.




Well, look, my point is that you posted a heart-felt piece the other day about how you weren't going to get drawn into JREF Amanda-apologist crap any more and encouraged others not to. This post of LJ, to me, looks like grade A crap - there's no validity to it, no cite, no reason, no reasoning and it utterly doesn't stand up. I can't think of a more stark example of the very stuff you said you were going to avoid than this, and no I don't think it, in any way, starts some new reasoning that has to be battered down; it's just everyday normal bullshit.

I do appreciate you consider me a pain in the tits. That's just life. I'm also in the habit of trying to point out to my friends when they are chasing their own tails. God knows I need my own mates to help me point that out when I am doing the very same. I can scroll and I REALLY don't mind what you post ex ante because I am not in a position, nor would I ever want to be, to dictate people's personal choice - it's your choice of course. But I'm just responding to your own heart-felt words and you look and sound like, to me, like posters who have sworn off the booze and grabbed the first spritzer you can see!!! :) I was trying to help you see that is all.



Yes, but I qualified it by suggesting that it be dealt with "here" instead. I never said to ignore the JREF completely.

And for the record, what I bring over here is no more then a mere fraction of what is posted over there...the vast majority of which I ignore. I'm selective about what I choose to tackle and I have my reasons for doing so, some of which you are now aware, others you are not.

And while you are right that it is "grade A crap" in one sense, what makes this different is that it's potentially dangerous grade A crap. I've been doing this a long time...long enough to recognise the birth of a new aggressive talking point.

I'll also give you another reason, on top of all the others. One of the primary purposes of PMF is to educate the public, our readership. In taking on some of these "grade A crap" arguments from the JREF, the rebuttal affords me (and others) the opportunity to explain elements about the case and/or the ILE that a part of our readership may be unaware of. For example, this recent episode may have enabled some readers to learn a good deal about how the ILE processes crime scenes (and why) that they didn't know before. It must be said, I have learned no little amount from reading others do the same. Education and information is the best weapon against ignorance and misinformation.

Essentially, what I'm saying, is that one needs to view the value in dealing with idiots like LJ, or whoever, in much broader terms.

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Offline stint7


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:04 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Fairly mad about the jury-pleasing dig. Counting to ten. I don't think we need that in here please.


SA;
"jury pleasing" was not intended as an anger provoking dig, and sincere apologies if so received.

Edited out as we speak

Well in awe of your particular persuasive prowess, and sincerely appreciative of all the great wit and wisdom you have shared with us here, just very respectfully and humbly do not share your opinion on this one point.

Again, please accept apology and pledge to be more careful in future

PS (Hope this made it before you reached 10)


Last edited by stint7 on Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:04 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools, I haven't recovered from the last bit!!!

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:11 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

And thank you very much, Jools, for your wonderful translations. You areally are a star!!!

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:18 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
And thank you very much, Jools, for your wonderful translations. You areally are a star!!!



I second that! :)

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Offline Jools


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:18 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
Err, Jools. Thank You? I need to ask you, while you were translating, was there a need for a large bottle of wine? Something stronger?? I take from *this* , that Amanda would rather be someone else. I'm afraid she's caught the google bug. The spelling has improved. The thought process, is, as usual, a puddle of mud. Just reading that, was a STRAIN!!! She honestly does not know who she os. Jump from velvety, to frozen. A snowman's nose to dizzy. I feel dizzy just trying to figure out what she's trying to say. Whatever Looongjohn has, Amanda has caught it. And, they're both not well.

Hi Cape,

Is actually stomach-churning! And apologies to those who don't want to read it to put you through this, but somehow if I share it has less of the sickening effect. I couldn't read this piece of crap and keep it to myself. :lol:

I presumed that she wrote this originally in English and then was translated for G's book, so is not possible to say whether her spelling has improved or not, but I guess she does have plenty of time to practice.
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:19 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stint7 wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Fairly mad about the jury-pleasing dig. Counting to ten. I don't think we need that in here please.


SA;
"jury pleasing" was not intended as an anger provoking dig, and sincere apologies if so received.

Edited out as we speak

Well in awe of your particular persuasive prowess, and sincerely appreciative of all the great wit and wisdom you have shared with us here, just very respectfully and humbly do not share your opinion on this one point.

Again, please accept apology and pledge to be more careful in future

PS (Hope this made it before you reached 10)



Stint, Stint, Stint,

One only ever cares about the opinion of people one respects. All ignored and dispersed and please ignore me. Give me one week and I hope I may have added something significant to our community. Back to you this time next week.


SA

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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:22 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
capealadin wrote:
And thank you very much, Jools, for your wonderful translations. You areally are a star!!!



I second that! :)



Thirded.

Seriously though, I'm going to have to reflect on this. She sounds much more disturbed or delusional than I had thought the prevailing winds indicated. As much as she clearly had her moments previously, which I could put down to stress, this stuff is just odd. It's not excusable odd, it's seriously plainly odd. Isn't it?

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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:28 am   Post subject: A MANDA (I mean..."A SHANDA") fur die goyim!!!   

capealadin wrote:
So, a quick recap. Amanda has gone from : * The NAZI within* to SHALOM. From being agnostic..to EVANGELICAL!!! Is there no end to this manipulative bitch?????????????/

cl-)
Amen, Sister Cape!
Quite the little conniving chameleon, isn't she? It's a classic sociopathic trait, along with impulsivity, superficiality, narcissisism and grandiosity.

I wouldn't be surprised if the next thing we hear is that a Hebrew (or Yiddish) language poem has been submitted in the upcoming Campanne Literature Competition with the nom de plume of
Miryam Shalom (i.e., "Marie Peace")--OY!!!!

CHUTZPA PREDICTION FOR AK : I sense it won't be long before AK starts identifying her "plight" with the "suffering of the Jews." :roll:

In any case, this remorseless killer is truly a-manda, I mean....'a SHANDA.... fur die goyim"
Feh! tu-))

Martha Stout, an author and expert on sociopathy writes:
"The sociopath has chameleon abilities which enable him or her to hide within the conforms of society. This person is often especially charming. This personality can then freely wreak havoc on the unsuspecting or naïve 96% of the rest of the population."

For reference, here is a
Photo of a
CHAMELEON, SINGING IN THE WIND


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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:43 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Can I please suggest, in all seriousness, that people try to read those words of Amanda very slowly and try to "understand" what is being said. It strikes me as a lot more disturbed than I had previously given credence to. I had previously had her down in the wide basket category of somewhat creditable / plausible defendant for all of the manifest issues with the evidence. This stuff is seriously just *odd*.

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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:45 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Jools wrote:


**I'd like to share my eyes with everyone - this explains the big and very expensive digital photo camera that I carry hanging from my neck. The best thing would be to wear a pair of glasses with built-in video camera, so it can record in real time everything I see. But I have two objections on this matter. The first is that I like that what I see creates a sort of unique and special relationship between myself and the rest of the world. The second is that I think that in my case a movie would be less incisive than a photograph. Something happens when you point the camera, you focus and you capture just one instant, as if it were the only one. The image is transformed into something universally understandable, extracted from the rest and lost forever. I've never tried to shoot movies, I think it requires a different mentality from mine. I don’t perceive my experiences like a flow of images that run in real time, but like a sequence of single shots. Linking my experiences with the passage of time seems to me an artificial mechanism, a concept superimposed to the images, instead of intrinsic. In other words, all my experiences could be reorganized also in a different order. And this would mean that also I would be a different person, because the person like the concept is inherited in the sequence and not just in the experiences themselves. I feel constantly the sensation that I could easily be someone else, it would be enough to throw in the air all the photos I took and re arrange them at random. I could be a different person. Instead no. It's me.

A chick ...
Butterfly Quiver-
Frozen spots –
Trinkets wrapped in cotton wool –
Soft air –
The nose of a snowman –
A velvety cheek –
The dizziness –
Evanescence –
Nudity –
**********


You are absolutely kidding me? I'm so sorry to do this to such a highly respected poster but you are saying that is a direct posting of her words - all of the above? Seriously?

I am, no comedy involved, radically re-evaluating my view on Knox this evening if this is from her hand. Seriously. Probably the biggest wow in a long time.



My translation: Amanda Knox is trying to read that book by Marcel Proust given to her by the nice Italian politician. She doesn't really understand it but wanted to share this relative lack of understanding with the world since she seems to have its attention. A captive audience. Someone pass me the bong, please. I need more.
Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens
Warm woollen mittens
Madeleine
Maman
Magic Lanterne
Gigot d'agneau
Sauce gibberish
Nudity
Navel gazing

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Offline mortytoad


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:45 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
I don't know, Some Alibi. Amanda may have copied something, but doesn't have a grasp of UNDERSTANDING what is on paper. Her, sort of poem, is like the Manders we know . Really doesn't know whether she's Arthur or martha. But for sure, doesn't want to be who she is.


Once a prententious flakey-flake, always a pretentious flakey-flake. Her latest middle-aged male suiter probably told her that her poems were brilliant and "deep". Even I know pure crap when I read it. Amanda, as a poet, you suck.
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:48 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Can I please suggest, in all seriousness, that people try to read those words of Amanda very slowly and try to "understand" what is being said. It strikes me as a lot more disturbed than I had previously given credence to. I had previously had her down in the wide basket category of somewhat creditable / plausible defendant for all of the manifest issues with the evidence. This stuff is seriously just *odd*.


Yeah; what he said.
This is very disturbing.
Really bizarre.

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Offline jodyodyo


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:37 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

It’s all too sweet and precious. She doesn’t like the moving film option, she prefers the photographs in her memories. But then she contradicts herself later. She would like to find a way to process all the contradictory parts of herself. She is (in her mind) very sweet, if things had rearranged themselves differently, there would be a different ending. I think she is struggling to find some way where she is the innocent in the story of her life. She cannot come to terms with what she has done. Can’t get it to square with her current reality. If she chose to go the religious route, she could declare it all a terrible mistake, claim her guilt, beg forgiveness and somehow go on. But she cannot do that in her mind. She is way too sweet, you see?
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Offline jodyodyo


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:51 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Just thought of something else. Her use of the word Evanescence. Evanescence is an artist who has a song called My Immortal.

Here are the words:

I'm so tired of being here
Suppressed by all my childish fears
And if you have to leave
I wish that you would just leave
'Cause your presence still lingers here
And it won't leave me alone

These wounds won't seem to heal
This pain is just too real
There's just too much that time cannot erase

[CHORUS:]
When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
I held your hand through all of these years
But you still have
All of me

You used to captivate me
By your resonating light
Now I'm bound by the life you left behind
Your face it haunts
My once pleasant dreams
Your voice it chased away
All the sanity in me

These wounds won't seem to heal
This pain is just too real
There's just too much that time cannot erase

[Chorus]

I've tried so hard to tell myself that you're gone
And though your still with me
I've been alone all along
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:54 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

mortytoad wrote:
capealadin wrote:
I don't know, Some Alibi. Amanda may have copied something, but doesn't have a grasp of UNDERSTANDING what is on paper. Her, sort of poem, is like the Manders we know . Really doesn't know whether she's Arthur or martha. But for sure, doesn't want to be who she is.


Once a prententious flakey-flake, always a pretentious flakey-flake. Her latest middle-aged male suiter probably told her that her poems were brilliant and "deep". Even I know pure crap when I read it. Amanda, as a poet, you suck.


AND--in addition to what Morty, Cape, and Jody just wrote--let's remember that Amanda (the flakey-flake who was always told she was special, a wunderkind) in addition to being disturbed, is a case of arrested adolescent development, someone who is living in a never-never land of unlimited possibilities (provided she's granted her freedom!!) with no responsibilities to anyone but herself.

Incarcerated at age 20, she's never really known the profane REAL WORLD where people have deadlines and performance reviews, where people make sacrifices, struggle to pay bills, have BALANCED relationships, raise children and/or have to be responsible for caring for OTHERS, doing the mundane trivial things of everyday life, ALL WITHOUT the constant attention/fascination/adoration AK has.

These "writings" are nothing but self-indulgent, puerile ramblings of a person with fantasies of grandeur who's pretending to be something she's not.

Unless she somehow finds the motivation to change, she's only going to get worse in the years to come.
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Offline DLW


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:55 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Mander says: ‘I've never tried to shoot movies, I think it requires a different mentality from mine. I don’t perceive my experiences like a flow of images that run in real time, but like a sequence of single shots.’

I'm sorry to hear that.To see life as a series of images frozen in time. Movies show how you go from one picture to the next. Not always the best way if you don’t want to, or find it unnecessary to think about what’s in between. Is this a form of what they call compartmentalization. But the brain works in real time, not just a simple flow of images. The in between stuff, including your thoughts, is always there in one form or another.

Michael(Quote): ’A Hollywood insider said: "Lifetime [the channel that has commissioned the film] appear to be extraordinarily confident that Amanda will lose her appeal." THE FIRST POST

Is this a misprint. In another location in the same article it says: ‘Various reports in recent months have suggested that Knox has a good chance of the December 2009 conviction being overturned because of a lack of DNA evidence at her murder trial.’

Does this Hollywood insider know something that these various reports don’t know. Is Lifetime hedging their bets. I’m confused.
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Offline jw


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:56 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Skeptical Bystander wrote:

Speaking on Long John, where is Doug Preston these days? He seems to have disappeared. Maybe he is working on his next novel, with a new twist. It has to do with the revival of a thousand year old satanic cult.



"FOA" - Fiends of Amanda?

jw
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Offline Lex Rex


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 4:44 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Can I please suggest, in all seriousness, that people try to read those words of Amanda very slowly and try to "understand" what is being said. It strikes me as a lot more disturbed than I had previously given credence to. I had previously had her down in the wide basket category of somewhat creditable / plausible defendant for all of the manifest issues with the evidence. This stuff is seriously just *odd*.


I agree, SA.

I hate to ascribe anything more than average intelligence to Knox (her spelling and grammar would not pass muster in the most lax junior high school to be found in my neck o' the woods), but could it be that Amanda is giving us an object lesson in Dadaism???

But then...Nah!

I've heard her speak and read her words. (Ditto for the mother that contributed 50% of her DNA complement.)

All this talk of "honors" must describe her (former) program of study rather than her GPA.

Even if f I'm wrong in this regard, I stand by my assertion that she's not a bona fide 'Dean's Lister' for I can EASILY imagine teachers and professors giving in to a distraught, bawling and manipulative Edda all through prep school and undergrad.

After all we've witnessed of the Knox clan since Nov. 2, 2007, can you IMAGINE trying to tell Edda that her daughter is a "C" student?! The SCENE it would create! "She's deep and complex, I tell you! The traditional grading methods cannot be applied to my special child! I know, I'm a teacher, too! I know people! I'll make calls!" I'd give Amanda an "A" just to get Edda, her tears (and the thinly veiled threat of a public campaign), out of my office and let Amanda's middling SAT scores keep her where she belongs.

PS Will get back to you soon re proposal.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 4:49 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

411, You're just hilarious :) And the singing chameleon.!!! How DO you all find these photos and links so quickly? Well, I get to be luck recipient, so no complaints.

Seriously, though, and in answer to Some Alibi's pertinent question. Reading it first left me uncomfortable. There isn't a PERSON behind it. Just someone trying to be something, or, more to the point, trying to COME ACROSS, as someone that she perceives is bright, deep, trying to evoke sympathy, but most important, trying to make people believe, THIS:

Look at how unfair it is, for ME, ME ME to be locked up. Look at what gifts I have to offer the world. Look at what the world is missing. My beautiful voice, which you cannot hear, but can read in my musings. ( SORRY, not feeling well, here).

The psycopath will take this opportunity, to show her *many* fans, that their belief in her is not misplaced. How can a person like her, such a free spirit, such a huge talent, with fuzzy thoughts of velvet, innocent recollections of snowmen ( remember the pic, everyone, of Saint Amanda, with a snowman), be capable of murder?? dizzy ( read girlish delight) , oh, and on and on.

The * Shalom *, just a quick little word there to let everyone know, she is not anti semetic. Riiiight. Guilty concience there. Interesting. Nothing in these musings about a life lost. No talk of suffering. ABSOLUTELY NOT. Musn't remind anyone of THE DEED. Ciao, Suckas.

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Offline lisareik


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 4:53 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
So, a quick recap. Amanda has gone from : * The NAZI within* to SHALOM. From being agnostic..to EVANGELICAL!!! Is there no end to this manipulative bitch?????????????/


That struck me too. "Shalom" for those who are unaware, besides being used in Hebrew to greet and part from one's cohorts, means PEACE.
Rather a sharp tunraround for this formerly high spirited murderer, who was anything but a peace lover.
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Offline Tara


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:18 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

jodyodyo wrote:
Just thought of something else. Her use of the word Evanescence. Evanescence is an artist who has a song called My Immortal.
Here are the words:

I'm so tired of being here
Suppressed by all my childish fears
And if you have to leave
I wish that you would just leave
'Cause your presence still lingers here
And it won't leave me alone

These wounds won't seem to heal
This pain is just too real
There's just too much that time cannot erase

[CHORUS:]
When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears
When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears
I held your hand through all of these years
But you still have
All of me

You used to captivate me
By your resonating light
Now I'm bound by the life you left behind
Your face it haunts
My once pleasant dreams
Your voice it chased away
All the sanity in me

These wounds won't seem to heal
This pain is just too real
There's just too much that time cannot erase

[Chorus]

I've tried so hard to tell myself that you're gone
And though your still with me
I've been alone all along



Hi Jodyodyo! :D

Amy Lee of the band Evanescence sang "Freak on a Leash" with Korn a couple years ago. If you haven't heard it, it's great.

I wonder if Knox relates to this song?



Freak On A Leash

Songwriters: Welch, Brian; Davis, Jonathan; Silveria, David; Arvizu, Reginald; Shaffer, James


Something takes a part of me
Something lost and never seen
Every time I start to believe
Something's raped and taken from me, from me

Life's kinda always been messing with me
You wanna see the light?
Can't they chill and let me be free?
So do I
Can't I take away all this pain?
You wanna see the light?
I try to every night, all in vain, in vain

Sometimes I cannot take this place
Sometimes it's my life I can't taste
Sometimes I cannot feel my face
You'll never see me fall from grace

Something takes a part of me
You and I were meant to be
A cheap f*** for me to lay
Something takes a part of me

Feeling like a freak on a leash
You wanna see the light?
Feeling like I have no release
So do I
How many times have I felt diseased?
You wanna see the light?
Nothing in my life is free, is free

Sometimes I cannot take this place
Sometimes it's my life I can't taste
Sometimes I cannot feel my face
You'll never see me fall from grace

Something takes a part of me
You and I were meant to be
A cheap f*** for me to lay
Something takes a part of me

Something takes a part of me
You and I were meant to be
A cheap f*** for me to lay
Something takes a part of me
Part of me, part of me
Part of me


YouTube; FREAK ON A LEASH

band-)

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Offline stilicho


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:29 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
So, a quick recap. Amanda has gone from : * The NAZI within* to SHALOM. From being agnostic..to EVANGELICAL!!! Is there no end to this manipulative bitch?????????????/


Knox is not too different than a lot of young adults (or even older ones) in this regard. Most people don't have a keen sense of history or of cultural distinctions. Hitler has gone from being a monster almost purely responsible for the deaths of millions of people to a sort of a curiosity. The Queen of England's grandson once dressed up as a Nazi for a party. The concept of racial-oriented politics is even ingrained in some nominally legitimate political parties.

As for agnosticism, it's ordinarily born of an emotional reaction similar to a "road to Damascus" moment for those who convert to Christianity.

In my experience, it takes a lifetime of reading and thinking to even approach a coherent and logical political or "spiritual" philosophy. And even then they are always subject to modification.

Another thing to remember is that a lot of people in prison become susceptible to emotionally liberating philosophies including Christianity. That's almost surely because of the redemptive properties associated with it. These days, the Church appears to focus on the "Saviour" instead of the confession of sins. I don't know what the particular chaplain at Capanne preaches or talks about but it would likely err on the side of compassion and salvation. You don't want to get the inmates all riled up about what they've done that's actually wrong.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:30 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks for that, Tara. As I was reading the words, something struck me. The parts where it goes * something takes a part of me *. I think Amanda TOOK. Took something from everyone that she was in contact with. A thief, leaving nothing but devastation in her wake. She took emotionally..from her family, from the cottage, and, in her manipulations, she takes. Including the prison Chaplain. This taker, who has no emotional boundaries, then took the ultimate. The life of a truly gifted, giving human being. Here's a reminder, lurkers. Her name: MERDITH KERCHER.

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:39 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I have a different take on this, Stilcho, with all due respect. Not too different from other young people in this regard? Amanda had the picture , of her, in a holocaust museum. She knew enough, with her German Heritage, to say to a Jewish genleman, * My people killed your people*. She knew enough about history to make that remark.

Sorry, but this *opportunistic* finding of the Evangelical Amanda is not going to fly with me. It's sitting right next to Steve Moore's statigically placed bible. Excuse spelling.

Perhaps, when people have admitted their sins, have shown remorse, new found religion is close by. My opinion, of course.

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Offline stilicho


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:47 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Skeptical Bystander wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Jools wrote:
**I'd like to share my eyes with everyone -

**********


You are absolutely kidding me? I'm so sorry to do this to such a highly respected poster but you are saying that is a direct posting of her words - all of the above? Seriously?

I am, no comedy involved, radically re-evaluating my view on Knox this evening if this is from her hand. Seriously. Probably the biggest wow in a long time.



My translation: Amanda Knox is trying to read that book by Marcel Proust given to her by the nice Italian politician. She doesn't really understand it but wanted to share this relative lack of understanding with the world since she seems to have its attention. A captive audience. Someone pass me the bong, please. I need more.
Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens
Warm woollen mittens
Madeleine
Maman
Magic Lanterne
Gigot d'agneau
Sauce gibberish
Nudity
Navel gazing


It is pretty hideous, isn't it.

I'd be much happier just reading in her own words why she killed Meredith and accused her boss of murder. In plain English or plain Italian--doesn't matter.
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Offline stilicho


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:54 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
I have a different take on this, Stilcho, with all due respect. Not too different from other young people in this regard? Amanda had the picture , of her, in a holocaust museum. She knew enough, with her German Heritage, to say to a Jewish genleman, * My people killed your people*. She knew enough about history to make that remark.

Sorry, but this *opportunistic* finding of the Evangelical Amanda is not going to fly with me. It's sitting right next to Steve Moore's statigically placed bible. Excuse spelling.

Perhaps, when people have admitted their sins, have shown remorse, new found religion is close by. My opinion, of course.


I think you've got your scenarios mixed. The photo of her in the museum was in Austria and she had the wrong war in mind. Over 600,000 on both sides died in the campaign between Italy and Austria-Hungary. It had nothing to do with Nazis or the Holocaust. She didn't know she was sitting in front of a Great War era air-cooled heavy machine gun (either a Vickers or a Maxim).

The sneering comment towards a Jewish "gentlemen" was--IIRC--related in The Stranger by Charles M [?] and related her off-hand dismissal of another college-aged kid. I don't think it's a particularly funny joke but I don't think she even knows how "her people"--the Germans--are distinct from Nazis.

So we're left with two examples of Knox simply not having enough history or common sense to identify anything other than a vague idea of Nazism and trying to be funny. Believe me, there are plenty of adults both young and old who would have no more historical or common sense than Knox does.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 6:07 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Well, she knew enough to call herself the Nazi within, and that it was the Nazi's who killed . I suppose, if she thinks it funny that 6 million jews were killed, yeah, then one English girl was no biggie.

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Offline stilicho


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 6:19 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
Well, she knew enough to call herself the Nazi within, and that it was the Nazi's who killed . I suppose, if she thinks it funny that 6 million jews were killed, yeah, then one English girl was no biggie.


I don't think I'm explaining myself well enough.

There are probably millions of people out there who don't know the difference between "the Germans" and "the Nazis". There are also probably thousands, if not tens of thousands, of people who think dressing as a Nazi for a party (including the Queen of England's grandson) isn't offensive. There were several people on this very board who didn't know that the museum (or at least the installation) where Knox sat in front of the machine gun was Great War vintage and not WWII. There are also lots of people with no historical or common sense who don't murder people.

My point is that there's no connection between Knox the insensitive boor and Knox the murderer. I don't see her insensitivity or boorishness as particularly noteworthy.

The rape stories are rather a different case. Not everyone writes with such urgency and relish about sexual assault as Knox demonstrably did. The rape "pranks" are also disturbing. That's just so you can understand where I see something quite distinct in Knox that you don't see in your run-of-the-mill insensitive boor.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 6:29 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Oh, I don't take the rape stories at all lightly, Stilicho. And, I abhor anything to do with nazism. And, yes, I knew about the dressing as a nazi by the grandson. I believe the English Monarchy only changed their name to Windsor in 1917, or shortly at the time of WW1.

I am reminded of something Stalin said : A million deaths is a statistic, the story of one man's death is a tragedy.

And, I have to say, I can't find one redeeming quality in Saint Amanda.

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Offline H9


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 6:57 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Can I please suggest, in all seriousness, that people try to read those words of Amanda very slowly and try to "understand" what is being said. It strikes me as a lot more disturbed than I had previously given credence to. I had previously had her down in the wide basket category of somewhat creditable / plausible defendant for all of the manifest issues with the evidence. This stuff is seriously just *odd*.


I think it sounds like some of my refrigerator poetry.....


I am not sure she is doing more than trying to sound 'deep' and meaningful' but I guess from some of the word choice we can tease out a few things that are on her mind but still.... it sounds more like a party game when you draw words out of a box and have to turn into some silly poem..


And Jools.. keep it coming! Thanks for all the writings and translations...... it is inspiring me to try some poetry again..


PS SA, don't go away for a week.....
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Offline Emerald


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:00 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

To Popper



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Offline donnie

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:19 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

This time of the year three years ago Meredith, young, beautiful, happy and very much alive entered the last week of her life. She already knew Raffaele Sollecito for what - 1 or two days and Amanda Knox for several weeks. Little much did she know that this pair along with Rudy Guede will cut her life short. She wasn't prepared, she wasn't warned. She lived her life to the fullest. And this song, according to many sources, was her favourite and fits very well this time of the year and I believe it should carry us on towards 1st november, which is All Saints Day. RIP Meredith.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ApU3107n ... re=related
And i apologize all the people here for my previous behaviour. Best wishes, Donnie
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:27 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I don't carry grudges, Donnie. And it's nice that you have remembered Meredith.

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Offline donnie

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:33 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
I don't carry grudges, Donnie. And it's nice that you have remembered Meredith.


Thank You.
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Offline Emerald


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:03 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Hi donnie. Welcome back.

I've been thinking a lot about Meredith, too. The grace and dignity of her Family and Friends before, during and after the the final verdict. I still get teary when watching the press conference after the trial.
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Offline donnie

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:13 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Emerald wrote:
Hi donnie. Welcome back.

I've been thinking a lot about Meredith, too. The grace and dignity of her Family and Friends before, during and after the the final verdict. I still get teary when watching the press conference after the trial.


They still maintain their grace and dignity. Especially when we consider the fact that so much is going right now. All the books, movies and hype surrounding the killers...It must be so hard, yet they act with grace and dignity as we mentioned.

Thanks Emerald.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:55 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Donnie, I honestly don't know how the Kerchers do it. Especially with Girlanda's book. I think it says a lot about Meredith, when we see how her parents handle themselves. OT/ Are you getting news in Poland on the Scazzi case?

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Offline stilicho


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:01 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
Oh, I don't take the rape stories at all lightly, Stilicho. And, I abhor anything to do with nazism. And, yes, I knew about the dressing as a nazi by the grandson. I believe the English Monarchy only changed their name to Windsor in 1917, or shortly at the time of WW1.

I am reminded of something Stalin said : A million deaths is a statistic, the story of one man's death is a tragedy.

And, I have to say, I can't find one redeeming quality in Saint Amanda.


I abhor extreme political movements of all sorts and nazism was one of the worst. The British royal family changed its name from Saxe-Coburg-Gotha to Windsor in 1917. I never saw the sense of that because their ancestors were Saxon and not Prussian. Saxony and Prussia were traditional enemies before the North German Confederation and the other German Imperial stylings.

Again, it's largely because people equated "German" with "the Kaiser" and therefore something bad. It's a little like people in the USA who make a big deal out of Obama's middle name "Hussein". Frankly, his middle name could be "Beelzebub" and it wouldn't make any difference to me.

But perception is important in politics and real life.
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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:11 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

“Io vengo con te” – book presentation
Rome, October 26 2010 17:30-18:45 - Palazzo Marini

I’ll just write down what I found significant in no particular order.

I had lunch in a bookstore next to Palazzo Chigi yesterday. One hour later I realized I had read half of Girlanda’s book. It’s a really easy read. Too easy.
It’s all about “me, me, me and more me” (sound familiar?).
He promotes himself (and his foundation) so much in the book that at a certain point I was not sure if the book was about Amanda Knox. Girlanda and Knox are using each other.

Less than 40 people in total were present.
Sitting next to Rocco Girlanda were:
Giampiero Gramaglia http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giampiero_Gramaglia (moderator, not involved in the case);
Patricia Thomas (Associated Press)
Pina Esposito (SkyTG24)
Cristiana Mangani (Il Messaggero)
Sabina Castelfranco (CBS) could not make it.

Meredith was mentioned after only 35 minutes from the start of the debate.

I got the impression that Girlanda had read the negative comments that appeared on the Internet (it almost seemed as if he was quoting from some of the comments I had read).
His statements were watered-down compared to the stuff I’d heard from him in the last few days.
For example, when Gramaglia asked Girlanda if he thought that Knox was innocent, RG said that he “does not know” and that “thankfully, it is not up to him to decide” (reading from his book).
We’ll see if that’s really the case in the next few weeks.

Not once did he mention that he wrote the book/is involved in the case because he thinks that he (or his foundation) has a role in US-Italy relations.

He recently purchased 4 laptops. Three were for his eldest children. The forth one was for AK and had it delivered to her a while back.
He met again with AK two days ago (so you can add that to the number of visits) and gave her a copy of his book.

The debate opened with a few sentences from Girlanda in which he explained that he started following the case after Sen. Cantwell made her “anti-Americanism” remarks.
Patricia Thomas stated that those remarks were “ridiculous” and that “anyone who has been to Italy or knows Italy knows they are not true”. In her words, “Italians simply love Americans” (vabbè, mo’ non esageriamo). Her spoken Italian is really good.
RG stated that he is interested in the state of the prisons in Umbria and that is why he went to visit AK in prison (yea, right… in his words, his “first visit to AK was the first time he had ever entered a prison”)and that the book was written “by chance” after his numerous encounters with her. He stressed numerous times that, as an MP, he has the right to visit prisoners.

I found out yesterday that one American journalist did visit AK in prison: Patricia Thomas.
She was present during RG’s very first visit to AK.
Patricia Thomas described the prison. She said it is a lot better than many summer camps she had been to when she was younger. The food is amazing and she could not believe that they even have bidets in the cells. She said that she got a lot of crap for writing about this a few months ago.
RG said that the men’s section of the prison is not as nice since it is overcrowded (but he made no mention of whom he visited in the men’s section).
PT could not believe that AK’s mom and sister were taking pictures of each other inside the Court (“as if they were tourists inside the Sistine Chapel”) only a few hours before the verdict.
PT spoke very highly of the Kerchers. In particular, she spoke of Merdith’s siblings at the press conference after the trial. She decribed them as “beautiful, well educated and articulate”.


Gramaglia asked the 3 journalists sitting next to him how they would have voted had they been on the jury panel:
PT, and she really did not want to answer this question, said that she would have acquitted AK and RS.
Pina Esposito said that, based on the evidence, AK and RS are guilty. She would have voted guilty.
Cristiana Mangani said that Rudy Guede alone killed Meredith and that “AK and RS are in prison based on NOTHING” (yes, she said “nothing”, NIENTE). So, of course, she would have acquitted.

PT said that AK was “terribly handled by the PR firm and the lawyers”. She said that in her opinion Dalla Vedova was hired for “opportunistic reasons” and that Ghirga was “like a father who could not control his exuberant kid”.
She said that “AK’s PR efforts” should have focused on Italy and not on the US and she added that “it’s a good thing that this book has come out a few weeks before the start of AK’s appeal”.

At this point, Gramaglia asks if anyone had any questions.
There was an ANSA journalist sitting in the first row that was really anxious to ask a question after Patricia Thomas made her remark about the book coming out “a few weeks before the start of the appeal”.
First of all he responded to PT by saying that stating that “it is good that this book has come out a few weeks before the appeal” is an insult to the Appellate Court. The ANSA journalist explained to PT that the book would have no effect whatsoever on the Court.
He then asked Girlanda how he responds to those accusing him of exploiting the case and being just another puppy in AK’s hands (and by the tone of his voice and how he asked the question, it seemed as if he was one of those making the accusations).
Girlanda replied by saying that the proceeds of the book were going to his foundation and that he would not be involved when the board decides how that money should be spent.
Regarding the puppy comment, Girlanda replied “they can think what they want”.

Suddenly, no more questions were being taken.
Gramaglia closed the debate at 18:45.

No cameras/cell phones with cameras were allowed in the conference room.
But, somehow, someone managed to take a picture of the book presentation anyway:
(left to right: Mangani, Girlanda, Gramaglia, Thomas, Esposito)


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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:18 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I have to agree, Stilicho, with your way of thinking. I personally love History, and was fortunate that my mother instilled a love of it in me, from an early age. A good education didn't hurt. It is fascinating how the lives of Queen Victorias sons turned out. But that's another story....

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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:24 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
smacker wrote:
Michael,

presumably the damages would be paid by Knox and Sollecito rather than their families ? I assume therefore, the awarded damages will not be paid.


Hi Smacker. Yes, that's right...on both counts. However, someone like Yummi or Clander could clarify exactly how it works...but it's possible they may be paid the compensation by the state in cases where the defendants have no assets and then Amanda and Raffaele would owe the state, so it's the state that would be out of pocket. Of course, nothing at all will be paid (by Amanda and Raffaele) unless and until the guilty verdicts and awarded compensations are upheld in the third and final appeal via the High Court.


I wish Michael. No, the Italian State will not pay any compensation to the Kerchers.
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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:24 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
I'm looking forward to your gem, Machine.

There is a female called Manda,
Who is waiting her trial for slander,
She's in prison for killing
And wants to go *hilling*
But she better not count on Clander.


:D
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Offline stint7


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:25 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thank You, Clander for sharing your experience at the Girlanda Book Presentation with us.

Very interesting read.
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:31 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Brilliant post Clander. I want to buy the ANSA journalist a glass of something of their preference!

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:32 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

THANK YOU SO MUCH, CLANDER!! Excellent reporting, and very informative. His remarks that he is interested in prisons in Umbria just riles me. I'm wondering if he had any say on who the panelists were. meaning, did he have an idea before hand, which way they were going, when asked the question, how would they have voted. Doesn't look good, not taking any further questions, when the first one was , from the audience, was negative. That says a lot.

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Offline mortytoad


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:37 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thank you, Clander. I was very much looking forward to reading your report of this event.
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Offline H9


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:07 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks Clander!! What a man!.. now if you can get some of the filming that is happening in Rome at the moment...



so only 40... by invitation? or how was news of this circulated?? just among the press?
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:25 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

DLW wrote:
Michael(Quote): ’A Hollywood insider said: "Lifetime [the channel that has commissioned the film] appear to be extraordinarily confident that Amanda will lose her appeal." THE FIRST POST

Is this a misprint. In another location in the same article it says: ‘Various reports in recent months have suggested that Knox has a good chance of the December 2009 conviction being overturned because of a lack of DNA evidence at her murder trial.’

Does this Hollywood insider know something that these various reports don’t know. Is Lifetime hedging their bets. I’m confused.



Perhaps they are releasing two versions to the press (under the claim of an insider, since if something is leaked it allows plausible deniability) in order to promote the idea via confusion that they're not going to take a firm line.

In any case, I don't believe them. Their character priorities via their casting tells me all I need to know.

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Offline H9


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:26 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Patricia Thomas reporting back in 2009 after visiting AK

Monday, December 14, 2009
By Patricia Thomas, AP


PERUGIA, Italy -- Amanda Knox told The Associated Press from her jail cell Sunday that she is scared but hopeful eight days after an Italian court sentenced her to 26 years in prison for the murder of her British roommate.
"I am scared because I don't know what is going on," the 22-year-old American student said during a 10-minute visit by two Italian lawmakers, prison officials and a pair of reporters in Capanne prison on the outskirts of Perugia.

Knox has been jailed for two years since she was arrested a few days after the slaying of Meredith Kercher in the house the two students shared in this Umbrian university town.

"I am waiting and always hoping," Knox said, switching from English into Italian for the delegation.

"I don't understand many things, but I have to accept them, things that for me don't always seem very fair."

Sitting on her bed in the 9-square-meter cell when the visitors arrived, the Washington State woman said "I was feeling horrendous" after the Dec. 5 verdict that she was guilty of murder and sexual assault.

http://www.chinapost.com.tw/print/236400.htm

OK, thanks. How are you guys?" said the American student, who had been sentenced eight days earlier to 26 years in prison for the murder of her British roommate. But minutes later, Knox confided, in answer to a question from an Associated Press reporter in her cell: "I am scared because I don't know what is going on."

http://www.cleveland.com/world/index.ss ... ap_th.html


When Associated Press reporter Patricia Thomas was in Capanne prison outside Perugia, Italy, Sunday and saw Knox, "They were passing food through the bars so the inmates could eat inside their cell, which seemed sort of sad to me."
Thomas provided a description of Knox to "Good Morning America" today of a young, timid woman who was so scared after her murder conviction that the female prison guards physically held her during the night to comfort her.

Knox, 22, also appears to be trying to not give in to despair and told Thomas she has applied to work in the prison laundry room to help pass the time and wants to complete her college degree while in prison.

"She said one of her big problems now is passing the time in prison…she is trying to work it out with her professors back in the states so she can finish her university degree," Thomas said.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/AmandaKnox/am ... id=9329773

Amanda Knox sounded casual, surprised even, by the simple question as it came through the door of her prison cell in English on Sunday: "How are you?"

"OK, thanks. How are you guys?" said the American student, who had been sentenced eight days earlier to 26 years in prison for the murder of her British roommate. But minutes later, Knox confided, in answer to a question from an Associated Press reporter in her cell: "I am scared because I don't know what is going on."

http://www.katu.com/news/79180937.html

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 40070.html


Last edited by H9 on Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:35 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Offline The Machine


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:32 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
Gramaglia asked the 3 journalists sitting next to him how they would have voted had they been on the jury panel:
PT, and she really did not want to answer this question, said that she would have acquitted AK and RS.
Pina Esposito said that, based on the evidence, AK and RS are guilty. She would have voted guilty.
Cristiana Mangani said that Rudy Guede alone killed Meredith and that “AK and RS are in prison based on NOTHING” (yes, she said “nothing”, NIENTE). So, of course, she would have acquitted.


Patricia Thomas mentioned that she had seen Amanda Knox in a cringeworthy interview with Robin Roberts for ABC News. Robin Roberts was really concerned about how Knox was doing as if Knox was an innocent American hostage being held captive in some Third World country.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/AmandaKnox/am ... id=9329773

I'm disappointed, but not surprised that Patricia Thomas would acquit Knox and Sollecito. Most of the American journalists that I have been in touch with know very little about the case and mistakenly believe that many of the FOA myths are true. I was genuinely shocked when CBS producer Sara Ely Hulse came out with so many factually incorrect statements.

Innocenisti journalists like Patricia Thomas and Cristiana Mangani need to specifically address the evidence rather than just say they would acquit Knox and Sollecito.
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:38 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander, 'our man in Rome' -

Excellent reporting...this is what PMF is all about!!! :)

Quote:
I found out yesterday that one American journalist did visit AK in prison: Patricia Thomas.
She was present during RG’s very first visit to AK.
Patricia Thomas described the prison. She said it is a lot better than many summer camps she had been to when she was younger. The food is amazing and she could not believe that they even have bidets in the cells. She said that she got a lot of crap for writing about this a few months ago.


And it was during that visit that Amanda told Girlanda that she'd gotten a fair trial. This caused the Melloxes to rush out to deny Girlanda's claims. These denials are made a mockery of considering jounalists such as Patricia Thomas were also present.

Quote:
PT could not believe that AK’s mom and sister were taking pictures of each other inside the Court (“as if they were tourists inside the Sistine Chapel”)


A LOT of people were down with that.

Quote:
She said that “AK’s PR efforts” should have focused on Italy and not on the US and she added that “it’s a good thing that this book has come out a few weeks before the start of AK’s appeal”.


I find it strange that she thinks that someone attempting to manipulate the appeal court with an emotive PR book is a "good thing". Does she believe that's how justice should work?

Quote:
PT said that AK was “terribly handled by the PR firm and the lawyers”. She said that in her opinion Dalla Vedova was hired for “opportunistic reasons” and that Ghirga was “like a father who could not control his exuberant kid”.


I think we all agree with her there.

Quote:
There was an ANSA journalist sitting in the first row that was really anxious to ask a question after Patricia Thomas made her remark about the book coming out “a few weeks before the start of the appeal”.
First of all he responded to PT by saying that stating that “it is good that this book has come out a few weeks before the appeal” is an insult to the Appellate Court. The ANSA journalist explained to PT that the book would have no effect whatsoever on the Court.
He then asked Girlanda how he responds to those accusing him of exploiting the case and being just another puppy in AK’s hands (and by the tone of his voice and how he asked the question, it seemed as if he was one of those making the accusations).


I REALLY like this guy.


Quote:
Regarding the puppy comment, Girlanda replied “they can think what they want”.

Suddenly, no more questions were being taken.
Gramaglia closed the debate at 18:45.


That says it all really.


Quote:
No cameras/cell phones with cameras were allowed in the conference room.
But, somehow, someone managed to take a picture of the book presentation anyway:


Well done someone! Wink, wink ;)

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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:39 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
His remarks that he is interested in prisons in Umbria just riles me. I'm wondering if he had any say on who the panelists were. meaning, did he have an idea before hand, which way they were going, when asked the question, how would they have voted. Doesn't look good, not taking any further questions, when the first one was , from the audience, was negative. That says a lot.


He definitely knows those journalists well so I am sure that he already knew how they would "vote".
Gramaglia made the call to end the debate as soon as he saw how annoyed Girlanda was after the question from the ANSA journalist (even though Girlanda started answering the question by saying "I'll answer in all serenity").

h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
so only 40... by invitation? or how was news of this circulated?? just among the press?


Actually, up until 18:15 (just before Girlanda read the Knox's email) there were only 30 people present.
They were all journalists.
I think I was the only one there that had not received the formal invitation from the USA-Italy Foundation (I sent an email to the Foundation the other day and told them that I wanted to join and so they added me to the list).

Here is "Io vengo con te" on display in the "latest books" section in the bookstore I mentioned earlier:


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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:45 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
Michael wrote:
smacker wrote:
Michael,

presumably the damages would be paid by Knox and Sollecito rather than their families ? I assume therefore, the awarded damages will not be paid.


Hi Smacker. Yes, that's right...on both counts. However, someone like Yummi or Clander could clarify exactly how it works...but it's possible they may be paid the compensation by the state in cases where the defendants have no assets and then Amanda and Raffaele would owe the state, so it's the state that would be out of pocket. Of course, nothing at all will be paid (by Amanda and Raffaele) unless and until the guilty verdicts and awarded compensations are upheld in the third and final appeal via the High Court.


I wish Michael. No, the Italian State will not pay any compensation to the Kerchers.



Well, I never imagined the Kerchers would get their damages from the state as the state isn't responsible in any way. I was more talking about the cottage owner. I mean after all, her cottage wasn't taken away by Raffaele and Amanda, it was only their actions that led to that happening. It was the state that impounded the cottage for so long. Therefore, I would have thought the state would have a responsibility to the cottage owner that it doesn't have to the Kerchers. Would it be different in the cottage owner's case or not?

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Offline bucketoftea


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:47 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
Meanwhile, he's posting up murders in supermarkets, although not one of them is his local supermarket and none of them are Italian supermarkets. It does not effect my statement that murders in supermarkets are not a common event :)

And for the record had the murder have taken place in the Conad supermarket rather then the cottage, that would have been sealed too.


I've been reminded of the Lane Bryant (a women's wear shop) murders in a suburb of Chicago in 2008. 5 women were shot to death in what the police think was a robbery gone wrong. Off the top of my head, the shop was closed for quite a while. Sorry no reference for that detail, but I followed it at the time because there was a bit of a lull in the double wife-muderer Drew Peterson cases (also Chicago suburbs) that I still follow. Not a supermarket, but.....
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:01 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

bucketoftea wrote:
Michael wrote:
Meanwhile, he's posting up murders in supermarkets, although not one of them is his local supermarket and none of them are Italian supermarkets. It does not effect my statement that murders in supermarkets are not a common event :)

And for the record had the murder have taken place in the Conad supermarket rather then the cottage, that would have been sealed too.


I've been reminded of the Lane Bryant (a women's wear shop) murders in a suburb of Chicago in 2008. 5 women were shot to death in what the police think was a robbery gone wrong. Off the top of my head, the shop was closed for quite a while. Sorry no reference for that detail, but I followed it at the time because there was a bit of a lull in the double wife-muderer Drew Peterson cases (also Chicago suburbs) that I still follow. Not a supermarket, but.....


To be honest, I think it also depends on the manner of the crime how long somewhere is sealed. For a simple crime (even if horrific) somewhere may not need to be sealed for too long. For example...here's what I mean by a simple crime...a group of people are in a shop and then suddenly someone runs in and shoots one of them and then runs out and makes their getaway, all witnessed by the other customers. It is a serious crime but it's rather simple crime scene. Aside from the body and maybe a spent cartridge on the floor (and perhaps a bullet hole in the wall) there is not going to be much potential evidence and little chance of new evidence arising that would require the police to return to the crime scene months later. The need to seal the shop for many months would not be so great and the owner could perhaps appeal to the court to have their property returned. The cottage in contrast, is an extremely complex crime scene where many criminal activities took place over a protracted period of time, complicated further in that the suspects lived/had previously visited there, other potential suspects lived/had previously visited there and the crime scene had clearly been tampered with, compounded by the fact there were no witnesses from inside the cottage during the murder to help clear up the mysteries.

It stands to reason that complex crime scenes are going to require longer sealing periods then simpler crime scenes.

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:06 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

TM wrote:
Innocenisti journalists like Patricia Thomas and Cristiana Mangani need to specifically address the evidence rather than just say they would acquit Knox and Sollecito.


Well, to be fair to her she (Patricia Thomas) really didn't want to answer the question on whether she would convict or acquit.

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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:43 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Can I please suggest, in all seriousness, that people try to read those words of Amanda very slowly and try to "understand" what is being said. It strikes me as a lot more disturbed than I had previously given credence to. I had previously had her down in the wide basket category of somewhat creditable / plausible defendant for all of the manifest issues with the evidence. This stuff is seriously just *odd*.


I think it sounds like some of my refrigerator poetry.....


I am not sure she is doing more than trying to sound 'deep' and meaningful' but I guess from some of the word choice we can tease out a few things that are on her mind but still.... it sounds more like a party game when you draw words out of a box and have to turn into some silly poem..


And Jools.. keep it coming! Thanks for all the writings and translations...... it is inspiring me to try some poetry again..


PS SA, don't go away for a week.....



I'm not going away for a week so furl in those flags of nations, party streamers and conical party hats y'all sor-) . However, I am going hunting metaphorical wabbits*. Product of which will be about a week from now.


SA

*Metaphorical Mungo, metaphorical geezer, alright?

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Offline tom_ch


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:54 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The Machine wrote:
Clander wrote:
Gramaglia asked the 3 journalists sitting next to him how they would have voted had they been on the jury panel:
PT, and she really did not want to answer this question, said that she would have acquitted AK and RS.
Pina Esposito said that, based on the evidence, AK and RS are guilty. She would have voted guilty.
Cristiana Mangani said that Rudy Guede alone killed Meredith and that “AK and RS are in prison based on NOTHING” (yes, she said “nothing”, NIENTE). So, of course, she would have acquitted.


Patricia Thomas mentioned that she had seen Amanda Knox in a cringeworthy interview with Robin Roberts for ABC News. Robin Roberts was really concerned about how Knox was doing as if Knox was an innocent American hostage being held captive in some Third World country.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/AmandaKnox/am ... id=9329773

I'm disappointed, but not surprised that Patricia Thomas would acquit Knox and Sollecito. Most of the American journalists that I have been in touch with know very little about the case and mistakenly believe that many of the FOA myths are true. I was genuinely shocked when CBS producer Sara Ely Hulse came out with so many factually incorrect statements.

Innocenisti journalists like Patricia Thomas and Cristiana Mangani need to specifically address the evidence rather than just say they would acquit Knox and Sollecito.

"Amanda Knox's prison cell is situated behind two secure doors, one a series of bars and the other "a big metal thing" with a small window. "

Well, duhhh! It's a prison cell, no?

Did she expect it to be a 5* hotel?

Tom
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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:12 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
Clander wrote:
Michael wrote:
smacker wrote:
Michael,

presumably the damages would be paid by Knox and Sollecito rather than their families ? I assume therefore, the awarded damages will not be paid.


Hi Smacker. Yes, that's right...on both counts. However, someone like Yummi or Clander could clarify exactly how it works...but it's possible they may be paid the compensation by the state in cases where the defendants have no assets and then Amanda and Raffaele would owe the state, so it's the state that would be out of pocket. Of course, nothing at all will be paid (by Amanda and Raffaele) unless and until the guilty verdicts and awarded compensations are upheld in the third and final appeal via the High Court.


I wish Michael. No, the Italian State will not pay any compensation to the Kerchers.



Well, I never imagined the Kerchers would get their damages from the state as the state isn't responible in any way. I was more talking about the cottage owner. I mean after all, her cottage wasn't taken away by Raffaele and Amanda, it was only their actions that led to that happening. It was the state that impounded the cottage for so long. Therefore, I would have thought the state would have a responsibility to the cottage owner that it doesn't have to the Kerchers. Would it be different in the cottage owner's case or not?


Oh, sorry. I thought you guys were referring only to the Kerchers.
Regarding the cottage owner, I do not know if she can ask the State for compensation.
I'll ask a few lawyers. Hopefully I'll be able to give you the precise articles which regulate these matters.
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:29 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Skeptical Bystander wrote:

Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens


I get yer Eliza, strike a light gawd bless ya.

_________________
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Offline donnie

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 12:38 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
Donnie, I honestly don't know how the Kerchers do it. Especially with Girlanda's book. I think it says a lot about Meredith, when we see how her parents handle themselves. OT/ Are you getting news in Poland on the Scazzi case?


I'm not familiar with the newest book, but as far as I'm concerned, this is the book where Meredith's name is mentioned once, right?

The Scazzi case is new to me. The media here didn't mention it, or I simply missed it. I tried to look it up at Google, but the results aren't impressive. Is this the case where the victims mother learned about death of her daughter while she was giving some live interview? That must have been shocking.
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Offline piktor


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:03 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
Clander wrote:
Michael wrote:
smacker wrote:
Michael,

presumably the damages would be paid by Knox and Sollecito rather than their families ? I assume therefore, the awarded damages will not be paid.


Hi Smacker. Yes, that's right...on both counts. However, someone like Yummi or Clander could clarify exactly how it works...but it's possible they may be paid the compensation by the state in cases where the defendants have no assets and then Amanda and Raffaele would owe the state, so it's the state that would be out of pocket. Of course, nothing at all will be paid (by Amanda and Raffaele) unless and until the guilty verdicts and awarded compensations are upheld in the third and final appeal via the High Court.


I wish Michael. No, the Italian State will not pay any compensation to the Kerchers.



Well, I never imagined the Kerchers would get their damages from the state as the state isn't responsible in any way. I was more talking about the cottage owner. I mean after all, her cottage wasn't taken away by Raffaele and Amanda, it was only their actions that led to that happening. It was the state that impounded the cottage for so long. Therefore, I would have thought the state would have a responsibility to the cottage owner that it doesn't have to the Kerchers. Would it be different in the cottage owner's case or not?


The state did not commit any crime at Pergola 7. The accused did. They are responsible for the cottage's loss of rent income for the owner.

Massei sentences Knox/Sollecito to:

"sentences KNOX Amanda Marie and SOLLECITO Raffaele to compensate for damages in dealings with the plaintiff constituted by Aldalia Tattanelli to be liquidated in a separate hearing, and Lyle Kercher, John Ashley Kercher and Stephanie Arline Lara Kercher awarding to the same an immediately executive provisional [compensation] of 10,000 euro.

Sentences the accused to jointly pay the reimbursement of the legal costs of the plaintiff Aldalia Tattanelli which liquidates in total to 23,000 euro in addition to a lump-sum refund, Value Added Tax and CPA as required by law."- Massei p.397

This means Biff/Anita have to pay 10,000 euros to the cottage owner. That covers at least 8 months of lost rent for Mrs. Tattanelli, the cottage owner.
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Offline H9


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:06 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:

Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens


I get yer Eliza, strike a light gawd bless ya.


What's wrong with the Sound of Music? ;-)
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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:23 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

piktor wrote:
Michael wrote:
Clander wrote:
Michael wrote:
smacker wrote:
Michael,

presumably the damages would be paid by Knox and Sollecito rather than their families ? I assume therefore, the awarded damages will not be paid.


Hi Smacker. Yes, that's right...on both counts. However, someone like Yummi or Clander could clarify exactly how it works...but it's possible they may be paid the compensation by the state in cases where the defendants have no assets and then Amanda and Raffaele would owe the state, so it's the state that would be out of pocket. Of course, nothing at all will be paid (by Amanda and Raffaele) unless and until the guilty verdicts and awarded compensations are upheld in the third and final appeal via the High Court.


I wish Michael. No, the Italian State will not pay any compensation to the Kerchers.



Well, I never imagined the Kerchers would get their damages from the state as the state isn't responsible in any way. I was more talking about the cottage owner. I mean after all, her cottage wasn't taken away by Raffaele and Amanda, it was only their actions that led to that happening. It was the state that impounded the cottage for so long. Therefore, I would have thought the state would have a responsibility to the cottage owner that it doesn't have to the Kerchers. Would it be different in the cottage owner's case or not?


The state did not commit any crime at Pergola 7. The accused did. They are responsible for the cottage's loss of rent income for the owner.

Massei sentences Knox/Sollecito to:

"sentences KNOX Amanda Marie and SOLLECITO Raffaele to compensate for damages in dealings with the plaintiff constituted by Aldalia Tattanelli to be liquidated in a separate hearing, and Lyle Kercher, John Ashley Kercher and Stephanie Arline Lara Kercher awarding to the same an immediately executive provisional [compensation] of 10,000 euro.

Sentences the accused to jointly pay the reimbursement of the legal costs of the plaintiff Aldalia Tattanelli which liquidates in total to 23,000 euro in addition to a lump-sum refund, Value Added Tax and CPA as required by law."- Massei p.397

This means Biff/Anita have to pay 10,000 euros to the cottage owner. That covers at least 8 months of lost rent for Mrs. Tattanelli, the cottage owner.


Yes, but if I understood Michael correctly, he is asking if Tattanelli can ask the Italian State for compensation should Knox/Sollecito not pay.
I do not think so but, as I wrote, I'll try to find the precise laws/regulations regarding compensation in cases of "sequestro probatorio".
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:28 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:

Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens


I get yer Eliza, strike a light gawd bless ya.


What's wrong with the Sound of Music? ;-)


Aitch,
It's quite loverly, dear, but SA's got his Julie Andrews musicals confused.
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Offline smacker


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:30 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

If I was Amanda i'd have taken every single opportunity, meeting or whatever to state 5-10 bullet points as to why, having received a fair trial an incorrect verdict was returned. Be it a meeting with Patricia Thomas, the Italian twerp/book writer/opportunistic coffer filler or anyone else who was prepared to listen and was capable of writing, I'd have repeated the same 5-10 points ad nauseum until someone told me to shut up because they were bored of hearing it.

I note in the interview with Patricia Thomas, which I'd either forgotten about, not read, or not felt ready to comment on that the best truth she can think of is that there are things she doesn't understand........well, FFS if yer don't, why not explain why ? here's a great opportunity...there's the mouthpiece (PT) sympathetic and ready to deliver a story.

I wonder why she didn't take that opportunity ?
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Offline piktor


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:43 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:

To be honest, I think it also depends on the manner of the crime how long somewhere is sealed. For a simple crime (even if horrific) somewhere may not need to be sealed for too long. For example...here's what I mean by a simple crime...a group of people are in a shop and then suddenly someone runs in and shoots one of them and then runs out and makes their getaway, all witnessed by the other customers. It is a serious crime but it's rather simple crime scene. Aside from the body and maybe a spent cartridge on the floor (and perhaps a bullet hole in the wall) there is not going to be much potential evidence and little chance of new evidence arising that would require the police to return to the crime scene months later. The need to seal the shop for many months would not be so great and the owner could perhaps appeal to the court to have their property returned. The cottage in contrast, is an extremely complex crime scene where many criminal activities took place over a protracted period of time, complicated further in that the suspects lived/had previously visited there, other potential suspects lived/had previously visited there and the crime scene had clearly been tampered with, compounded by the fact there were no witnesses from inside the cottage during the murder to help clear up the mysteries.

It stands to reason that complex crime scenes are going to require longer sealing periods then simpler crime scenes.


Also, the defence motions to delay processing at the cottage was used as a tactic:

The bra clasp was recovered 48 days after it was spotted as a result of the defence tactic to delay for as long as possible the retrieval of this evidence.

The defence was part and parcel of the delays in the investigation, scientific discovery and judicial process.

For example it was Biff lawyer Bongiorno that asked the trial be held on Fridays and Saturdays.

It is good and great for the defence to imply "incompetence" by the police, while pretending the defence itself is not part of the circus. Works great with the outside public.

Does public opinion really matter? No. What matters to the judges doing the judging is the case at hand, not the popularity contest on TV and other media.

The outside media soap opera has nothing to do with the well-crafted and credible Massei Report. It is all that matters, really.

The Ciolinos, the Bremners and the Moores can cry foul all they want. They do not matter to the Kercher case. They are a sideshow that bears no weight at the end of the day.

These white knights help in no way unless their unintended purpose is to mislead the public, which is all they are doing in reality.
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 1:51 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The 411 wrote:
h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:

Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens


I get yer Eliza, strike a light gawd bless ya.


What's wrong with the Sound of Music? ;-)


Aitch,
It's quite loverly, dear, but SA's got his Julie Andrews musicals confused.



That's what I meant to type but I was talking to the Beagle Defence League on the telephone and got confused!!!

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:00 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Piktor wrote:
The state did not commit any crime at Pergola 7. The accused did. They are responsible for the cottage's loss of rent income for the owner.


Yes I know, but that's not really quite what I meant. Due to the actions of the accused the house owner has had the state seize their property for a long period of time, a period where debts and bills on the property still need to be paid while at the same time is gaining no income to cover those debts and costs. At the same time it would be years before they receive their awarded compensation, if they even get it then. In this case, fortunately the owner was able to bear the cost but that may not be so in all cases where some may end up seeing their property repossessed. Therefore, I was thinking there must be some sort of system in place whereby the owner could recoup some of those costs from the state while awaiting their compensation from the accused or at least some other help from the state. Otherwise, the result would be a lot of innocent people losing their assets through no fault of their own. So, I was wondering what, if any, provision is made for these people. Ultimate responsibility may lie with the accused, but at the end of the day it is the state that's seized their property, it's the state that has all the money and the state that's responsible for putting in safeguards for its citizens so that they are not unfairly penalised.

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THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:03 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
Yes, but if I understood Michael correctly, he is asking if Tattanelli can ask the Italian State for compensation should Knox/Sollecito not pay.
I do not think so but, as I wrote, I'll try to find the precise laws/regulations regarding compensation in cases of "sequestro probatorio".


Yes, well either that or any other kind of help at all. I'm almost certain their insurance wouldn't cover that kind of thing.

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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:04 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:

Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens


I get yer Eliza, strike a light gawd bless ya.



Didn't Julie Andrews sing that?



_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


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Offline Tara


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:14 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
Piktor wrote:
The state did not commit any crime at Pergola 7. The accused did. They are responsible for the cottage's loss of rent income for the owner.


Yes I know, but that's not really quite what I meant. Due to the actions of the accused the house owner has had the state seize their property for a long period of time, a period where debts and bills on the property still need to be paid while at the same time is gaining no income to cover those debts and costs. At the same time it would be years before they receive their awarded compensation, if they even get it then. In this case, fortunately the owner was able to bear the cost but that may not be so in all cases where some may end up seeing their property repossessed. Therefore, I was thinking there must be some sort of system in place whereby the owner could recoup some of those costs from the state while awaiting their compensation from the accused or at least some other help from the state. Otherwise, the result would be a lot of innocent people losing their assets through no fault of their own. So, I was wondering what, if any, provision is made for these people. Ultimate responsibility may lie with the accused, but at the end of the day it is the state that's seized their property, it's the state that has all the money and the state that's responsible for putting in safeguards for its citizens so that they are not unfairly penalised.



Insurance. Here in the US at least. The policy you buy to cover your rental property has a coverage built in to it that covers "Loss of Rents" for up to 12 months for a covered loss. As long as the owner doesn't destroy their own property, there is coverage for the damage to the house and loss of rental income. Then, the insurance company subrogates against the responsible party or parties. I have seen what happened here covered in this way.

Edited to add:

To take this one step further, let's say the tenants were found negligent of causing the loss to the property. This is why Renters Insurance is so important, yet so many are caught without it.

For instance, you are a tenant that causes a fire to the Landlord's home, you are found negligent and the Landlord looks to you to pay (or their insurance company "subrogates" against you to pay). This is picked up by the tenant's Liability portion of their policy.

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Last edited by Tara on Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:16 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Yara wrote:
Insurance. Here in the US at least. The policy you buy to cover your rental property has a coverage built in to it that covers "Loss of Rents" for up to 12 months for a covered loss. As long as the owner doesn't destroy their own property, there is coverage for the damage to the house and loss of rental income. Then, the insurance company subrogates againts the responsible party or parties. I have seen what happened here covered in this way.



I see, thanks Tara. I hope Italian insurance covers that sort of thing too.

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Offline windfall


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:21 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

A few random thoughts in response to recent posts.

1) Thanks very much to Clander for the book launch report. Really interesting.

2) The latest addition to Knox's literary works is fascinating, as others have noted. But one thing that strikes me is the futility of the task of trying to piece together a "real" person out of the fragments we have of AK. The temptation is to see those fragments as machine-cut jigsaw pieces that just need to be locked into place for the "real" AK to emerge, in three dimensions, from that puzzle. I think it's more like we have hundreds of pieces of a broken bowl, some of them dispersed and irrecoverable. We can try and fix them back into what seems like a coherent pattern, but I am not sure it's ever achievable.

In saying this, I don't mean to imply there is anything particularly deep and complex about Knox herself. It would be the same for anyone in such circumstances. Thanks to the media, we get flashes of these people - whether it's Knox in machine-gun mode; "my people killed your people"; "Shalom"; "dirty Jew" - to take one recent example - and then we lock these into what seems like a coherent whole (somewhere on the spectrum between utterly crass and actively anti-Semitic). Does this in any concrete sense fix an aspect of Knox's identity? I am not convinced it does.

It is interesting that even in a forum such as this one, where there is a high degree of consensus on key aspects of the case, there are still any number of little Knoxes running around (scary image, I know): the manipulative bitch; the psychopath; the sociopath; the psycho-sociopath; the irresponsible and unthinking young woman caught up in a perfect storm of drink, drugs and sex.

There have been many Knoxes out there in the mediatized world, whether it's the Mellox version, the tabloid version, the prosecution's version; the various images Knox has tried on for size over the past few years (ingenue; whacky individualist; religious convert; whatever)... And that's before we start trying to figure out what might have gone on in Knox's head over that period of time. As a for instance, just maybe this conversion is a real deal: she's starting to come to terms with what she has done. She's still going to keep her eyes fixed on acquittal until all hope is finallly gone, and she's staring down another 20 years or so, but perhaps somewhere there is a dawning realisation of the enormity of her crime.

Thing is... all that, too, is just another possible truth amongst many.

3) Another quick thought on the movie version. As I have said before, the outrage many here feel about it is understandable. On the other hand, much as we might like film producers, say, to act with a sense of decency and attempt to empathise with Meredith's family, that's not the world we live in. A terrible event such as this one, with the global media coverage it attracted, is bound to be seen as fair game. Many here clearly devote a lot of time, thought and emotion, day by day, to what happened to Meredith. I think it can lead to a loss of perspective on how others might relate to that. This is not in any way to denigrate those committed to the TJMK cause, but I don't think we can pretend that everyone is going to feel the same way.

4) The recent "smelled of sex" discussion. Just wondering if many people here think that AK and RS had sex after murdering Meredith, some time in between the crime and the clean up.
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:31 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

smacker wrote:
If I was Amanda i'd have taken every single opportunity, meeting or whatever to state 5-10 bullet points as to why, having received a fair trial an incorrect verdict was returned. Be it a meeting with Patricia Thomas, the Italian twerp/book writer/opportunistic coffer filler or anyone else who was prepared to listen and was capable of writing, I'd have repeated the same 5-10 points ad nauseum until someone told me to shut up because they were bored of hearing it.

I note in the interview with Patricia Thomas, which I'd either forgotten about, not read, or not felt ready to comment on that the best truth she can think of is that there are things she doesn't understand........well, FFS if yer don't, why not explain why ? here's a great opportunity...there's the mouthpiece (PT) sympathetic and ready to deliver a story.

I wonder why she didn't take that opportunity?


AK certainly has not lacked for conduits to the outside world and apparently has no qualms about granting audiences and holding court in her cell. So why has she not used these opportunities to get her points across and defend her innocence? She had a perfect opportunity with Girlanda, which she used instead to turn in a few pending creative writing assignments that she found crumpled up at the bottom of her backpack.

Here's one she forgot to submit.


The happy wanderer by Amanda Knox, as told to Rocco Girlanda

I love to go a-wandering,
Along the mountain track,
And as I go, I love to sing,
My knapsack on my back.

Chorus:
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra-
Val-de-ri--Val-de ha ha ha ha ha ha
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra.
My knapsack on my back.

I love to wander by the stream
That dances in the sun,
So joyously it calls to me,
"Come! Join my happy song!"

Chorus:
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra-
Val-de-ri--Val-de ha ha ha ha ha ha
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra.
My knapsack on my back.

I wave my hat to all I meet,
And they wave back to me,
And blackbirds call so loud and sweet
From ev'ry green-wood tree.

Chorus:
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra-
Val-de-ri--Val-de ha ha ha ha ha ha
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra.
My knapsack on my back.

High overhead, the skylarks wing,
They never rest at home,
But just like me, they love to sing,
As o'er the world we roam.

Chorus:
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra-
Val-de-ri--Val-de ha ha ha ha ha ha
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra.
My knapsack on my back.

Oh, may I go a-wandering
Until the day I die!
Oh may I always laugh and sing
Beneath God's clear blue sky!

Chorus:
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra-
Val-de-ri--Val-de ha ha ha ha ha ha
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra.
My knapsack on my back.


Well, okay, she didn't write this one but she could have.

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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:47 pm   Post subject: CLANDER'S CAMERA CLIQUE   

Clander wrote:

Patricia Thomas stated that those remarks were “ridiculous” and that “anyone who has been to Italy or knows Italy knows they are not true”. In her words, “Italians simply love Americans” (vabbè, mo’ non esageriamo).

I

Clanderrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!! nnn-)) Come ti permetti di fare questa battuta anti-americana!?!?!

But, seriously, SEI BRAVISSIMO!! tt-) Un bel reportaggio-Grazie! cl-)

Hey.... did you ever find out whether they were able to nab that rogue Roman paparazzo who managed to take that UNAUTHORIZED photo, on the sly, for PMF?
Do the police have the perpetrator's.. uh..."prints" on record..?
Let me know what....."develops." ss-) (sorry)

CLANDER'S CAMERA CLIQUE

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Offline Patzu


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Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2009 5:10 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:47 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

piktor wrote:
The Ciolinos, the Bremners and the Moores can cry foul all they want. They do not matter to the Kercher case. They are a sideshow that bears no weight at the end of the day.

These white knights help in no way unless their unintended purpose is to mislead the public, which is all they are doing in reality.


A song for the white knights by Emitt Rhodes...

In Days Of Old

In days of old when knights were bold we sailed across the sea

To see what we could see yes to see what we could see

To slay the dragon, to save the maiden, to hear the angels sing

Well we weren't quite what we seemed, no we weren't quite what we seemed

In days of old

The king, the Pope they sat and moped they needed a game to play

So they started a crusade, yes they started a crusade

And all the knight from across the land decided this must be fun

So they would play along, yes they would play along

In days of old

To slay the dragon, to save the maiden, to hear the angels sing

Well we weren't quite what we seemed, no we weren't quite what we seemed

In days of old

Well my legs were shaky, my voice was quaky, my armor shined in the sun

And the battle had just begun, yes the battle had just begun

I turned my steed and I started to flee as my stirrup turned into a noose

And I couldn't wiggle it loose, no I couldn't wiggle it loose

o slay the dragon, to save the maiden, to hear the angels sing

Well we weren't quite what we seemed, no we weren't quite what we seemed

In days of old
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Offline cyyates


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:52 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I don't really understand why a select few are bagging on Hayden.....she is just an actress who is doing her job, which is to play characters. Her comments are all job related...nothing more. She isn't an advocate trying to prove her stance by acting a part out? I don't get it. She's acting out a part...?? That is what actors do. It's just a disgusting situation, but I don't see the worth in bagging on Hayden P.
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Offline stilicho


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:52 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The Machine wrote:
Clander wrote:
Gramaglia asked the 3 journalists sitting next to him how they would have voted had they been on the jury panel:
PT, and she really did not want to answer this question, said that she would have acquitted AK and RS.
Pina Esposito said that, based on the evidence, AK and RS are guilty. She would have voted guilty.
Cristiana Mangani said that Rudy Guede alone killed Meredith and that “AK and RS are in prison based on NOTHING” (yes, she said “nothing”, NIENTE). So, of course, she would have acquitted.


Innocenisti journalists like Patricia Thomas and Cristiana Mangani need to specifically address the evidence rather than just say they would acquit Knox and Sollecito.


First, many thanks to Clander for that report. I agree fully with The Machine that the journalists, especially in their "spare time", need to focus on the reasons they would have acquitted instead of issuing such vague statements. I know that event would not have been the platform to do that but there are many opportunities presented to journalists to explain their private views without compromising their integrity or stealing someone else's forum.

Specifically, I think, journalists need to explain whether and why theirs is an advocacy position (or not). This is no different than expecting a politician to reveal and defend their own beliefs as well as whatever the official agenda of their party is.

I find it difficult to believe that any journalist could reconcile a belief in their innocence with anything other than an advocacy position (or sheer ignorance of the facts of the case). This isn't a tough case to figure out. It's not as though there is a big stack of evidence somewhere that the investigators ignored. We'd know about it by now.
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:57 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

lisareik wrote:
capealadin wrote:
So, a quick recap. Amanda has gone from : * The NAZI within* to SHALOM. From being agnostic..to EVANGELICAL!!! Is there no end to this manipulative bitch?????????????/


That struck me too. "Shalom" for those who are unaware, besides being used in Hebrew to greet and part from one's cohorts, means PEACE.
Rather a sharp tunraround for this formerly high spirited murderer, who was anything but a peace lover.


Though she did choose Marie PACE as her nom de plume.

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Offline stilicho


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Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 2:24 am

Posts: 2492

Location: Western Canada

Highscores: 8

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:05 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

windfall wrote:
A few random thoughts in response to recent posts.

2) The latest addition to Knox's literary works is fascinating, as others have noted. But one thing that strikes me is the futility of the task of trying to piece together a "real" person out of the fragments we have of AK. The temptation is to see those fragments as machine-cut jigsaw pieces that just need to be locked into place for the "real" AK to emerge, in three dimensions, from that puzzle. I think it's more like we have hundreds of pieces of a broken bowl, some of them dispersed and irrecoverable. We can try and fix them back into what seems like a coherent pattern, but I am not sure it's ever achievable.

In saying this, I don't mean to imply there is anything particularly deep and complex about Knox herself. It would be the same for anyone in such circumstances. Thanks to the media, we get flashes of these people - whether it's Knox in machine-gun mode; "my people killed your people"; "Shalom"; "dirty Jew" - to take one recent example - and then we lock these into what seems like a coherent whole (somewhere on the spectrum between utterly crass and actively anti-Semitic). Does this in any concrete sense fix an aspect of Knox's identity? I am not convinced it does.


Agreed. I don't think many of the things we've seen about Knox are relevant to her role as one of the three murderers. I pointed out my reasons above.

windfall wrote:
3) Another quick thought on the movie version. As I have said before, the outrage many here feel about it is understandable. On the other hand, much as we might like film producers, say, to act with a sense of decency and attempt to empathise with Meredith's family, that's not the world we live in. A terrible event such as this one, with the global media coverage it attracted, is bound to be seen as fair game. Many here clearly devote a lot of time, thought and emotion, day by day, to what happened to Meredith. I think it can lead to a loss of perspective on how others might relate to that. This is not in any way to denigrate those committed to the TJMK cause, but I don't think we can pretend that everyone is going to feel the same way.


IMO, it's simply tasteless. There are many movies and media productions that cross the line into insensitivity. This adds to the suffering of the victims.

I wouldn't say I'm "outraged", though. There are plenty of things to be outraged about but making a movie sympathetic to Knox is not one of them. I would be more apt to say it was predictable.

windfall wrote:
4) The recent "smelled of sex" discussion. Just wondering if many people here think that AK and RS had sex after murdering Meredith, some time in between the crime and the clean up.


I haven't really responded to much of this speculation. But, since you're asking, I don't think they did. I don't doubt that Knox had showered after the murder but that the intensity of the hours leading up to the arrival of the Postal Police left her in the dishevelled and unwashed mess found by them (surprised and embarrassed) outside the cottage around noon the next day.
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Offline The Machine


Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:43 pm

Posts: 2306

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:08 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stilicho wrote:
I agree fully with The Machine that the journalists, especially in their "spare time", need to focus on the reasons they would have acquitted instead of issuing such vague statements.


When innocenisiti journalists have given reasons why they think Knox and Sollecito are innocent, they are usually based on key FOA myths. For example, the double DNA knife doesn't match the wounds on Meredith's neck, the double DNA knife has been essentially ruled out, Knox's confession was thrown out, Knox wasn't provided with an interpreter on 5 November 2007, there is no physical evidence of Knox at the crime scene, Knox has no criminal record etc.
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Offline The 411


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Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2009 6:49 pm

Posts: 1386

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:08 pm   Post subject: WHAT HAPPENED TO TIZIANO?--PMF's Tasmanian Treasure!!   

Skeptical Bystander wrote:



Here's one she forgot to submit.


The happy wanderer by Amanda Knox, as told to Rocco Girlanda

I love to go a-wandering,
Along the mountain track,
And as I go, I love to sing,
My knapsack on my back.

Chorus:
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra-
Val-de-ri--Val-de ha ha ha ha ha ha
Val-de-ri--Val-de-ra.
My knapsack on my back. ..




Well, okay, she didn't write this one but she could have.


And OF COURSE she wants to sing that carefree song-- to the wind--in all of the 27 languages she's learned while in prison.

Here's an early version of this song--IN GERMAN!!--from 1954--with footage of Lake St. Clair in Tasmania (Australia--GO CATNIP!!--and wait--Tasmania?

WHERE OH, WHERE HAS OUR OWN TASMANIAN TREASURE TIZIANO GONE??? :(

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Offline bucketoftea


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Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 2:09 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:30 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I'm wondering if there will be sales of Girlanda's book assured according to the number of vulnerable middle-aged Italian men.

Thank you for the excellent report, Clander.


Last edited by bucketoftea on Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline The Machine


Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:43 pm

Posts: 2306

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:36 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

There are a couple of newspaper articles about the film with Hayden Panettiere:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/ar ... death.html

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/showbiz/a ... -for-tv.do
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Offline windfall


Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 12:22 pm

Posts: 608

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 3:58 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

TM, thanks for the links. It's genuinely unnerving to see these mirror images. On another note, that purple sweater in the picnic scenes is pretty unnerving in itself.

Stilicho, I tend to agree on the smelliness point. That makes much more sense to me. It's interesting nonetheless that such a comment found its way into the discourse.

(Potentially annoyingly off topic alert)
In the Ruth Snyder case, the tabloid coverage included a story that Snyder and her lover Judd Gray had sex either in the same room as the body, or the next room, after they had murdered Ruth's husband.
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Offline The 411


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Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2009 6:49 pm

Posts: 1386

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 5:02 pm   Post subject: THE NOSE KNOWS! (KNOX's NOXIOUSNESS)   

windfall wrote:
4) The recent "smelled of sex" discussion. Just wondering if many people here think that AK and RS had sex after murdering Meredith, some time in between the crime and the clean up.




A very unsettling, unpleasant thought to contemplate. I don't think they engaged in sex in the hours after the murder. But certainly NOT out of some new-found sense of moral propriety. (see tasteless dialogue below). They were simply too damn busy.

NB: My Implausible and Tasteless Dialogue carries a
411 VULGARITY ALERT!!

_________________________________________________________________________
IN THE EARLY HOURS OF NOVEMBER 1...

Amanda: "Amore mio, I loooooooove you. Baciami! Sono cosi` felice!!!!"
Raff: "Mmmmmmmmmmm! ahhhh manda...Che bello....Ti voglio bennnnnnnnnn...
Ahhhhhhhhh......Siiiiiiiiii!!! cosiiiiiiiiiiiii` hump-)


.....SILENZIO ASSOLUTO....

Amanda:
Amore?!! Raffaele?!!! Ci sei?.. Tutto bene ?

Raff: "Ma, nooooooo!!!....ASPETTA!!!!!DIO MIO!!! Cosa facciamo qui a fare le porcherie?" :shock:

(411 Interjection: where's that piggy smiley when you need it?)

"Abbiamo appena ucciso Meredith, tesoro....non e`per niente giusto di
fare l'amore.... beh...almeno non SUBITO dopo......vero, cara??????"

Amanda
: Oh, gia`....si...`...Raffale...hai perfettamente ragione....
__________________________________________________________________________
sor-) It was as nauseating for me to write that as it was for you to read it.

But I'd bet anything AK DID have exude a distinctly stale sexual odor but it was a lingering aroma from earlier on. Perhaps even from DAYS earlier.

As is well known, addicts and drug-obsessed people often make basic hygiene a verrrrry low priority...

Ok, I gotta go...take a much-needed scrub in a hot shower...and a take a few swigs of
MAALOX.
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Offline SomeAlibi


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Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 11:23 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:51 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

AAAAAAAAAAaaand we're back :) Cheers Michael and Clander...

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What it is is spin lent credence because it's from the mouth of a lawyer. We've seen how much gravitas they can carry merely by saying something is or is not so when often they are speaking as much rubbish as anyone else.
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Offline Fly by Night


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:58 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

SomeAlibi wrote:
AAAAAAAAAAaaand we're back :) Cheers Michael and Clander...



Good to see the lights back on! Thanks, Michael, for all you do!!!
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Offline dgfred


Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:19 pm

Posts: 1082

Location: N.C., USA

Highscores: 13

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:59 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks guys, I was already suffering withdrawal symptoms.
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Offline dgfred


Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:19 pm

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Location: N.C., USA

Highscores: 13

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:01 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

So happy I can now post and stay logged in 8-) .
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Offline Jools


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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:38 pm

Posts: 2241

Location: Spain

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:02 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Today's article from Panorama-Blog:

Amanda Knox: They think that I will become a nun.
By: Rocco Girlanda

It has been almost three years since the night between 1 and 2 November 2007 where Meredith Kercher was murdered in Perugia. For the crime were sentenced Amanda Knox to 26 years, her boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito and the friend Rudy Guede. Amanda has always maintained she innocent, and her life in prison is now the subject of a book, “I’m coming with you” (Piemme edizione, 17 euros), penned by Rocco Girlanda, MP and chairman of the Italy-USA. The image and the report is an exclusive to Panorama.

"So for your birthday what would you like to receive?". We are in silence for some seconds. Her expression changes. I realize what she is about to tell me just by looking at her eyes. There is no need for her to start talking. I get a bit angry with myself for having asked this question, it was hard not to connect it to the situation she is living. I ask my self more times, in silence, so many whys, until I hear her voice. "Freedom..." she whispers with a look of melancholy. "It's strange, you know. Even my family asked me this question. But all things in my life are not the same without the most important thing. I like reading, I like listening to music, I really like very much working on the computer now that I’m able to. But..." She stops looking at her hands.

I've never seen so much sadness on the face of a 22-year-old girl. This time it's I that wants to hug her. But I do not. I strain to speak of the next initiative we’re thinking of organizing for her, like a meeting with the president of the Seattle-Perugia twinning association, Mike James, who I will meet here in Italy in a few weeks. But I’m not able to continue without confessing to her my anxiety. I look at her.

I take a deep breath before speaking: "I feel sad knowing what you going through”. Amanda apologizes, as if she is to blame for my discouragement. "I'm sorry, it’s... is that I was thinking of the situation, the birthday. You know, all the birthdays I have spent here I have not celebrated that much, throughout. I think I'll celebrate my birthday when I get home. I know it's something a bit strange, but when I think of celebrating my birthday, I imagine it with my family. And if they are not there for me is not a birthday".

"Even the last time we left, the last time we were here, we were sad after leaving” I reveal to her. "I'm so sorry...."

"Look Amanda, among friends there should never be pretence, especially with regards to feelings. A female friend or a male friend is good also for to say: "I'm sad”. There is no sense in forcing one so appears to be happy, if it is not true. As there is no reason in you not saying what you feel, as it wouldn’t be a reason for us to be covering from you what we see and feel. It's part of friendship, is part of life also to share the moments when the smile tarnishes for a while. But the sincerity of feelings is something so beautiful and so rare that it is worth even a moment of sadness".

Now she is close to me, so fragile. If I think of what they wrote and said about her, it seems I live in an unreal dimension. I remember the episode when the great Oriana Fallaci met with the South Vietnamese General Nguyen Ngoc Loan, head of the National Police of the Republic of Vietnam. Escaped from Vietnam, took refuge in the United States, where he opened a pizzeria in the suburbs of Washington DC. For her, probably, it was to be only just an encounter with a General portrayed everywhere as ruthless, one who callously executed Vietcongs with a shot to the head in front of the Associated Press photographers, like the famous photo taken at Saigon that’s been shown around the world. Instead they talked of other things, the family, the children, about life.

The meeting between the author and former army General was long, intense, full of sensibility. At the end she hugged him. In her book “Nothing and so be it”, the General is quoted several times. Fallaci wrote about him: "When you realize that good and evil are points of view, as the true and false, right and wrong, every road seems uncertain, and any opinion arbitrary. Feel sure only of your doubts".

"With the computer what kind of work are you doing for the university?" I ask her to brake these moments of bitterness and despair. "I'm writing a lot. I am writing short stories in Italian and English, which then I send to my professor. As you know, he has in fact built a sort of course for me, so I can continue with the university. He’s been very kind towards me. And the computer helps me so very much”.

Back to smiling, telling me of her studies. "We saw a priest that we don’t known him long, during our visit. Are you doing activities with him?”. "I don’t know who he is, I saw that he speaking with Don Saulo."

Don Saulo Scarabattoli is the Catholic priest who attends the female section; each day he brings his spiritual support to the detainees. He is one of the people who knows Amanda more deeply and to whom she confides in since she is been here. To be clear, if Amanda were a believer, we could say that he is her confessor.

"You always go to mass, right?". "Yes, in fact Don Saulo counts on me to recite the exhortations during mass. I'm used to reading the Bible and learn certain lessons. I started in high school. I went to a Jesuit school and I tried to study the Bible in order to understand the things it contains. There are not many people here who have a spiritual training which allows to express a thought that it complements what is read during church service. We are two usually who write the exhortations. And so far I have missed only one mass, when I was in court".

"Actually, you missed another because of us: I remember once you arrived with a prayer leaflet in your hand and you told us you were at mass" I joke smiling.

"In fact, you're right. And Don Saulo then asked me where I went and why did I have to leave in the middle of mass…" she says.

"Excuse me Amanda, I'm no theologian, but if you're not a believer can you all the same read texts and exhortations during the church service? Forgive the question, I do not want to get in your spirituality and your privacy, but is just for understanding".

"I've talked about this with Don Saulo. He appreciates my attitude toward the Bible. I am not a believer, it is true, but I’m not closed to what the Bible may say. And you know what? ".

"Tell me, Amanda..." "Don Saulo is convinced that I will become a nun,” reveals after a moment of silence. "He sees that I read the prayers with sincerity, and that I hear them with just as much sincerity".

I ponder in silence, once again, how the media image that is built on a person is so distant and detached from the true spirit and the feeling that this girl in front of me raises, face to face, whoever gets closer to her inner side.

"I honestly think is a rather remote hypothesis". I say to her.

"Oh, yes. I also think the same as you".

"We instead we see you married, with a husband and children. But not with the Tibetan monk husband from the dream though…".

She even joins in laughter, together with me.

"A few days ago I attended a debate sponsored by the University for Foreigners, here in Perugia, sponsored by the Italy-USA Foundation. Theme was "Obama, between criticism and consensus." Think that before we started there were people who even wanted to talk about your case during the debate. Obviously I opposed to it".

"It would have been a very stupid thing, what have I got to do with Obama?” She asks, quite rightly appalled.

"Nothing. In fact it would have been the odd instrumental twist, perhaps to catch a bit of the media spotlight on the cheap. I said that if they brought up the case of Meredith, I'd be gone. We addressed the President’s serious crisis of approval, so soon after his election".

"I heard that it fell below 50 percent. I do not understand why people don’t give him the chance to try to do something. "

"You know, the mood of voters, particularly American ones, are very fickle. In one way or another" I tell her while in the meantime we get to the books that we brought for her this time.

Editorial
Wednesday, October 27, 2010
Panorama-Blog
br-))
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Offline capealadin


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Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:58 am

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:05 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

There's always a light at the end of the tunnel...Thanks, Michael and Clander. Now, where were we?

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Offline stilicho


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Location: Western Canada

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:06 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The Machine wrote:
There are a couple of newspaper articles about the film with Hayden Panettiere:


Some folks have recently wondered why a lot of the readers are not OK with Hayden P's public bleatings about the movie she's promoting. I'm reminded not only of the serenity exhibited by the Kerchers but also the example of Steve Bartman--the Cubs fan who leaned over and inadvertently interfered with a live ball during a playoff game. The notorious fan was offered into the tens of thousands to do various advertisements or appear for various charities yet he didn't. He didn't go on the talk show circuit although he easily could have become quite wealthy as a consequence.

The point is that not everyone with the chance sells out. Some things are more important to some people than money is. It's also Hayden P's decision to be involved with this project or not.

In this regard, she is certainly fair game for criticism.

--------------

PS: That was a quick two weeks downtime, Michael! huh-)
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Offline Clander


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Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:26 am

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Location: Rome

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:09 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

we're back in business :)
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Offline dgfred


Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:19 pm

Posts: 1082

Location: N.C., USA

Highscores: 13

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:13 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Maybe Hayden could just do the movie... without the commentary and promotions, like the other actors.
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Offline Michael

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Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 7:06 pm

Posts: 16732

Location: England

Highscores: 113

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:15 pm   Post subject: ADMINISTRATOR NOTE!   

Administrator Note:

Hello everyone, good to see you all again :)

Okay, to explain things in an uncomplicated way, PMF had a script issue. The script was causing problems on our host's server and they therefore blocked it. Unfortunately, that script happened to be the script that allowed people to view topics. So, it meant nobody could access topics and instead got an error message. The script still needs to be addressed, but I've talked our hosts into allowing the script again. The price for that though is I have now had to make the forum (aside from the gallery and portal) readable by members only, to lower the server load. That means you will all have to sign in each time you want to read the forum and non-members will have to register. It's not my choice...it's the only way I could get the lights turned back on. Hopefully, that requirement will be only a temporary affair and I shall be working on it to get it fixed.

In the meantime, I would like to extend my thanks to Clander and Pete for their help in this matter.

Welcome back everyone!!! :)

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:18 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stilicho wrote:
PS: That was a quick two weeks downtime, Michael! huh-)


It's a half fix and we're not out of the woods yet. I'm afraid things may get worse again before they get better.

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
PMF ON TWITTER
PMF FORUM RULES
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Offline bucketoftea


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Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 2:09 pm

Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:19 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

During the hiatus I stumbled upon this wonderful example from The Daily Mail "Science and Technology" pages

Is this a time-traveller in a Charlie Chaplin film? Footage from 1928 shows woman 'using a mobile phone'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... z13aoFqqNw


Last edited by bucketoftea on Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Michael

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Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2008 7:06 pm

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Location: England

Highscores: 113

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:19 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Welcome back dgfred :)

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
PMF ON TWITTER
PMF FORUM RULES
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Offline TomM


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Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:28 pm

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Location: California

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:19 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
“Io vengo con te” – book presentation
Rome, October 26 2010 17:30-18:45 - Palazzo Marini

***

Gramaglia asked the 3 journalists sitting next to him how they would have voted had they been on the jury panel:
PT{Patricia Thomas}, and she really did not want to answer this question, said that she would have acquitted AK and RS.***

Maybe the reason she didn't want to say is she didn't want to choose between expressing her real opinion and compromising her access during the upcoming proceedings. Since it is unlikely that her saying she would have voted to acquit will cause either Mignini or Comodi to not answer any of her questions, her response way have be made in for the purpose of enabling her to do her job rather than to accurately express her personal views.
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Offline capealadin


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Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:58 am

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:22 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks also Pete. Aha, so no lurkers from somewhere else able to lurk? I hear the gnashing of some teeth!! Just think, having to register, and show a little neediness. Love it :).

Jools: I love you.......

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Offline dgfred


Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:19 pm

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Location: N.C., USA

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:26 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
Welcome back dgfred :)


Thanks Michael :D . I've been here everyday and read every page... just not able to post.
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Offline bucketoftea


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Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2009 2:09 pm

Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:29 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thank you for getting it back together.

That was a bit exciting, like being evacuated to the Chat Box escape capsule, lol.
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Offline Clander


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Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:26 am

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Location: Rome

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:29 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

My congrats to Michael. He managed the "crisis" in the coolest way possible.
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Offline windfall


Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 12:22 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:33 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Just wanted to add my thanks, too, for the sterling work in getting things moving again so swiftly.
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Offline Corrina


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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 4:20 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:35 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stilicho wrote:
The Machine wrote:
There are a couple of newspaper articles about the film with Hayden Panettiere:


Some folks have recently wondered why a lot of the readers are not OK with Hayden P's public bleatings about the movie she's promoting. I'm reminded not only of the serenity exhibited by the Kerchers but also the example of Steve Bartman--the Cubs fan who leaned over and inadvertently interfered with a live ball during a playoff game. The notorious fan was offered into the tens of thousands to do various advertisements or appear for various charities yet he didn't. He didn't go on the talk show circuit although he easily could have become quite wealthy as a consequence.

The point is that not everyone with the chance sells out. Some things are more important to some people than money is. It's also Hayden P's decision to be involved with this project or not.

In this regard, she is certainly fair game for criticism.

--------------

PS: That was a quick two weeks downtime, Michael! huh-)



Does she qualify as a serious actress? From what I've seen, she's T and A. Her type of talent is a dime a dozen.
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Offline Corrina


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:35 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I was feeling rather naughty, what with that forbidden screen popping up like that.
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Offline Jools


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Location: Spain

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:37 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
Thanks also Pete. Aha, so no lurkers from somewhere else able to lurk? I hear the gnashing of some teeth!! Just think, having to register, and show a little neediness. Love it :).

Jools: I love you.......

Me 2 Cape!
hugz-)

P.S. I'll continue with some transl. from where I left it yesterday. The creative writing nonsense in the book.
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Offline H9


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:43 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools... the translations are priceless! Thanks for doing this for the board. You are a star!
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Offline dgfred


Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:19 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:44 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

LJ has already commented on the script problem... quite nosey of what pmf is saying isn't he.
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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:45 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

TomM wrote:
Clander wrote:
“Io vengo con te” – book presentation
Rome, October 26 2010 17:30-18:45 - Palazzo Marini

***

Gramaglia asked the 3 journalists sitting next to him how they would have voted had they been on the jury panel:
PT{Patricia Thomas}, and she really did not want to answer this question, said that she would have acquitted AK and RS.***

Maybe the reason she didn't want to say is she didn't want to choose between expressing her real opinion and compromising her access during the upcoming proceedings. Since it is unlikely that her saying she would have voted to acquit will cause either Mignini or Comodi to not answer any of her questions, her response way have be made in for the purpose of enabling her to do her job rather than to accurately express her personal views.


Okay, let me add one thing to my report (which may be important or not).
Patricia Thomas, before answering that question said: "well, if I had been on an American jury panel I would have acquitted AK and RS" (and I thought: WTF does THAT mean???).
I could not understand why she said "if I had been on an American jury panel".
Maybe you guys can decipher that sentence.


Last edited by Clander on Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Corrina


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:45 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

She goes to mass at every opportunity.

Having known a few people who found themselves on the wrong side of the law, none of whom were the least bit religious, they all went to any religious service they could just to get out of the cell. Nothing new here.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:46 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The site went dark, and then I read Error,
I thought " Oh, Fark" felt a moment of Terror,
Thank goodness for Michael, Clander and Pete,
We're back to posting, I've taken my seat,
I'm only relieved, that it wasn't my fault,
Cause when it comes to comps, I'm truly a dolt :)

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Offline Solange305


Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2010 12:14 am

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:47 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

BTW, who knew that someone could imply that a website is unpopular, not realizing that his insults prove that he visits said website at least on an hourly basis..... wh-)
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:47 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina wrote:
stilicho wrote:
The Machine wrote:
There are a couple of newspaper articles about the film with Hayden Panettiere:


Some folks have recently wondered why a lot of the readers are not OK with Hayden P's public bleatings about the movie she's promoting. I'm reminded not only of the serenity exhibited by the Kerchers but also the example of Steve Bartman--the Cubs fan who leaned over and inadvertently interfered with a live ball during a playoff game. The notorious fan was offered into the tens of thousands to do various advertisements or appear for various charities yet he didn't. He didn't go on the talk show circuit although he easily could have become quite wealthy as a consequence.

The point is that not everyone with the chance sells out. Some things are more important to some people than money is. It's also Hayden P's decision to be involved with this project or not.

In this regard, she is certainly fair game for criticism.

--------------

PS: That was a quick two weeks downtime, Michael! huh-)



Does she qualify as a serious actress? From what I've seen, she's T and A. Her type of talent is a dime a dozen.



Maybe just A? :D

Ok I know it's wrong but the problem is I'm headed for a weekend of bad behaviour. I just know I'm going to land up in trouble and I don't give a stuff. Not one single stuff. You couldn't stuff a hamster's pillow with the amount of stuff I do not give :)

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What it is is spin lent credence because it's from the mouth of a lawyer. We've seen how much gravitas they can carry merely by saying something is or is not so when often they are speaking as much rubbish as anyone else.
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Offline Corrina


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:48 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

LJ is just like Santa and God. All knowing, all seeing.

It's likely all that hot air comes in quite handy when inflating his girlfriend.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:50 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Some Alibi: Take me with you !!!!!!!!

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:51 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina: Laughing OUT LOUD :)

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Offline bucketoftea


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:51 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
Jools... the translations are priceless! Thanks for doing this for the board. You are a star!


Absolutely. Thanks.

Just BTB, I wonder what the psychologists make of AK tracing round her hand by way of a signature. Anyone?
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Offline Solange305


Joined: Sat Sep 04, 2010 12:14 am

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:52 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Quote:
It's likely all that hot air comes in quite handy when inflating his girlfriend.


I'll bet Corrina! lol
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Offline dgfred


Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:19 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:52 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina wrote:
LJ is just like Santa and God. All knowing, all seeing.

It's likely all that hot air comes in quite handy when inflating his girlfriend.


Thanks for the afternoon giggle :D .
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Offline SomeAlibi


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:53 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina wrote:
LJ is just like Santa and God. All knowing, all seeing.

It's likely all that hot air comes in quite handy when inflating his girlfriend.



ROFL. Zing!!!

_________________
What it is is spin lent credence because it's from the mouth of a lawyer. We've seen how much gravitas they can carry merely by saying something is or is not so when often they are speaking as much rubbish as anyone else.
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:56 pm   Post subject: Hallelujah!   

All together now, Grateful PMF Choir!!! dance-)

Sing it LOUD !!! A song of Appreciation for our Captain, his mate, and all the crew who helped out!!!


MICHAEL BROUGHT DAH BOARD BACK ON

Michael brought dah Board back on, hall-e-lujah! w-((
Michael brought dah Board back on, hall-el-ujah!

My fellow posters are all a-board, hall-elujah!
My fellow posters are all a-board, hall-elujah!
Michael brought dah Board back on, hall-e-lu-jah!
Michael brought dah Board back on, halle-lu-jah!

Clander helped to fix dah mess, hall-e-lujah!
Clander helped to fix dah mess, hal-e-lujah!
The problem was deep, but Clander was wise, hallelujah!
For quite a while, wuz a rocky ride, !hall-eluuuuuuuuuuuujah!!!

Hallelujah, we're back on board! Yay-) th-)
But now I have to work on my lyric-writing skills.... n-((
SAIL ON, PMF!!!!

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Offline bucketoftea


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 8:57 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina wrote:
She goes to mass at every opportunity.

Having known a few people who found themselves on the wrong side of the law, none of whom were the least bit religious, they all went to any religious service they could just to get out of the cell. Nothing new here.


It's an opportunity to gain attention; working her acting chops reading the lesson, playing guitar, singing. Score.
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Offline Corrina


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:01 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks to everyone involved in getting us back up and running.

As the rain here has let up, I'm heading outdoors where I belong.

Enjoy your day/evening. Don't take any crap from anybody.
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:07 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Solange305 wrote:
BTW, who knew that someone could imply that a website is unpopular, not realizing that his insults prove that he visits said website at least on an hourly basis..... wh-)


Well actually, it's the fact that PMF is SO popular that was in large part the problem. It was putting a huge load on our host's server. That's why they had to kill the script...too many people were trying to use it.

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
PMF ON TWITTER
PMF FORUM RULES
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Offline Michael

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:09 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
My congrats to Michael. He managed the "crisis" in the coolest way possible.



Well, it's lucky for me you weren't able to see me on camera, I wasn't feeling so 'cool' ;)

_________________
"The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is." ~ Winston Churchill mike


THE MURDER OF MEREDITH KERCHER WIKI
PMF ON TWITTER
PMF FORUM RULES
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Offline windfall


Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 12:22 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:12 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Thanks to Jools for the latest instalment.

So Knox hasn't got religion after all. Not yet, anyway.
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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:13 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

First, thanks for gettin' us back on track, Michael, et al.

Jools wrote:
Today's article from Panorama-Blog:

Amanda Knox: They think that I will become a nun.
By: Rocco Girlanda

(blah-di-blah-di-blah... and more blah blah blah... sadness....laughter.... nuns... birthdays... Obama... male menopausal hormones....)


Okay. And here's an interview where Meredith Kercher gives all HER intimate thoughts on religion, birthdays, and Obama:

Quote:















Ooooops, I FORGOT, no one can interview Meredith because Amanda KILLED HER!!!!!!!

gggrrrrrrrrr ff)

Can anyone doubt that an interview with Meredith would have been about a zillion times more interesting???!

ss)

r-(( Meredith Kercher


Last edited by Earthling on Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:15 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

I think it's possible that Amanda is suffering from the Madonna complex.

It's almost like she was trying to gauge Rocco's reaction to the *nun* thing. When he *dismissed* that notion, because...well, that's not in his fantasy scenario :) she's quick to agree.

These two deserve each other. It's a toss up, who's the fucker and the fuckee?

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Offline The Machine


Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:43 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:17 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Michael wrote:
Solange305 wrote:
BTW, who knew that someone could imply that a website is unpopular, not realizing that his insults prove that he visits said website at least on an hourly basis..... wh-)


Well actually, it's the fact that PMF is SO popular that was in large part the problem. It was putting a huge load on our host's server. That's why they had to kill the script...too many people were trying to use it.


Bruce Fisher will have breakdown when he reads this. His nerves must already be frayed at the prospect of Amanda Knox losing her appeal.
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:21 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Yeah, Machine. He may have to wait for quite awhile before he gets one of those *hugs*. He can chat to Loooongjohn and company while he waits in line........

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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:21 pm   Post subject: Forbidden 403 & 404 Feelings   

Corrina wrote:
I was feeling rather naughty, what with that forbidden screen popping up like that.


Yeah, me, too, Corrina!

Imagine how I felt: The very moment I pushed the "send button" for the post containing my tawdry semi-pornographic Italian dialogue, up popped that white screen.

I was promptly informed that I, The 411 had committed a "403" and "404 error" and I was "forbidden" access. eee-)

I actually thought it was a Divine Message and that I had caused the crisis, due to....ya know...having "impure thoughts" :oops:
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:27 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

bucketoftea wrote:
h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
Jools... the translations are priceless! Thanks for doing this for the board. You are a star!


Absolutely. Thanks.

Just BTB, I wonder what the psychologists make of AK tracing round her hand by way of a signature. Anyone?


You mean--her trademark hand job? :oops:

Sorry, I couldn't resist...
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Offline Clander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:27 pm   Post subject: Re: Forbidden 403 & 404 Feelings   

The 411 wrote:
Corrina wrote:
I was feeling rather naughty, what with that forbidden screen popping up like that.


Yeah, me, too, Corrina!

Imagine how I felt: The very moment I pushed the "send button" for the post containing my tawdry semi-pornographic Italian dialogue, up popped that white screen.

I was promptly informed that I, The 411 had committed a "403" and "404 error" and I was "forbidden" access. eee-)

I actually thought it was a Divine Message and that I had caused the crisis, due to....ya know...having "impure thoughts" :oops:


UAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 9:47 pm   Post subject: Re: Forbidden 403 & 404 Feelings   

Clander wrote:
The 411 wrote:
Corrina wrote:
I was feeling rather naughty, what with that forbidden screen popping up like that.


Yeah, me, too, Corrina!

Imagine how I felt: The very moment I pushed the "send button" for the post containing my tawdry semi-pornographic Italian dialogue, up popped that white screen.

I was promptly informed that I, The 411 had committed a "403" and "404 error" and I was "forbidden" access. eee-)

I actually thought it was a Divine Message and that I had caused the crisis, due to....ya know...having "impure thoughts" :oops:


UAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA


Yeah, I can just imagine, that must have been really funny, 411!!!

oop-) bricks-) :)

ETA: I'd ask you to translate that post, 411, but I'm going now to eat dinner, and I'd like to keep it down, bwahaha!

And JOOLS, Thanks for all the translations lately!!!

dm-) th-) hugz-)


Last edited by Earthling on Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline lisareik


Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 7:42 pm

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Location: Israel

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:01 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

bucketoftea wrote:
h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
Jools... the translations are priceless! Thanks for doing this for the board. You are a star!


Absolutely. Thanks.

Just BTB, I wonder what the psychologists make of AK tracing round her hand by way of a signature. Anyone?


Can you tell where this took place? In what context?
Thank you.
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:17 pm   Post subject: Missing Meredith   

Earthling wrote:


Okay. And here's an interview where Meredith Kercher gives all her intimate thoughts on religion, birthdays, and Obama:

Quote:







EARTHLING:

THE SILENCE IS DEAFENING. And that's very, very sad, and it makes us all very angry, too.

Meredith's absence has been felt acutely and WILL be felt acutely every day, literally for longer than any of us will be alive. That pain and loss will live on for generations, because Meredith's nieces and nephews and all future Kercher generations will know OF her, but will they will NEVER have the joy of knowing HER and all the potential she had.

A question about Manders' unprecedented celebrity : There have been scores of repugnant murders, especially in recent decades.
But has there ever been an UNREPENTANT convicted killer in history, who has been so fawned over, so coddled --ever??? I can't even begin to think of another murderer, WITH NOTHING SPECIAL TO OFFER, with such a deluded fan base.

And what's this about her having received a laptop from Rocco ? Is that just for word processing? Why hadn't AK had a computer before this, perhaps selected by and given to her by Chris, if prison regulations permitted this?

Or, did Girlanda break a few rules to insure Little Angel had her own up-to-date computer.

Exactly how many inmates, besides Manders there have their own laptop, Onorevole Girlanda? st-))

I wouldn't be surprised if some of those laptop-less inmates have already CONFESSED to their crime, and are making great efforts to reform themselves while in prison.

Wouldn't THOSE INMATES be MUCH MORE DESERVING of your generosity?
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:25 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
TomM wrote:
Clander wrote:
“Io vengo con te” – book presentation
Rome, October 26 2010 17:30-18:45 - Palazzo Marini

***

Gramaglia asked the 3 journalists sitting next to him how they would have voted had they been on the jury panel:
PT{Patricia Thomas}, and she really did not want to answer this question, said that she would have acquitted AK and RS.***

Maybe the reason she didn't want to say is she didn't want to choose between expressing her real opinion and compromising her access during the upcoming proceedings. Since it is unlikely that her saying she would have voted to acquit will cause either Mignini or Comodi to not answer any of her questions, her response way have be made in for the purpose of enabling her to do her job rather than to accurately express her personal views.


Okay, let me add one thing to my report (which may be important or not).
Patricia Thomas, before answering that question said: "well, if I had been on an American jury panel I would have acquitted AK and RS" (and I thought: WTF does THAT mean???).
I could not understand why she said "if I had been on an American jury panel".
Maybe you guys can decipher that sentence.



Let me give it my best shot: Patricia Thomas currently still has "access" to AK and her entourage. In order to keep it, she needs to give the impression at all times that she is innocentisti.

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Offline stilicho


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:28 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
It's almost like she was trying to gauge Rocco's reaction to the *nun* thing. When he *dismissed* that notion, because...well, that's not in his fantasy scenario :) she's quick to agree.


My brain started seizing up while reading that. You're right, of course. The passages Jools kindly translated appear to be intentionally flirtatious. And I mean both the writer and the subject. The dialogue is dreadful.

Nobody cares if Knox is a nice girl or not. Everyone in prison is innocent.

I can see a lot of resentment against Knox by the other inmates if only for this book and the special treatment she's been getting. I think Girlanda needs to spend a few weeks in prison to really get the feeling down. He ought to write books about all the sex crime and murder convicts and find out how really decent they all are once you get to know their inner souls.
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Offline mortytoad


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:31 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

A non believer who can recite prayers and verses from the bible with sincerity would be an actress?
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:34 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
Today's article from Panorama-Blog:

Amanda Knox: They think that I will become a nun.
By: Rocco Girlanda

It has been almost three years since the night between 1 and 2 November 2007 where Meredith Kercher was murdered in Perugia. For the crime were sentenced Amanda Knox to 26 years, her boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito and the friend Rudy Guede. Amanda has always maintained she innocent, and her life in prison is now the subject of a book, “I’m coming with you” (Piemme edizione, 17 euros), penned by Rocco Girlanda, MP and chairman of the Italy-USA. The image and the report is an exclusive to Panorama.

"So for your birthday what would you like to receive?". We are in silence for some seconds. Her expression changes. I realize what she is about to tell me just by looking at her eyes. There is no need for her to start talking. I get a bit angry with myself for having asked this question, it was hard not to connect it to the situation she is living. I ask my self more times, in silence, so many whys, until I hear her voice. "Freedom..." she whispers with a look of melancholy. "It's strange, you know. Even my family asked me this question. But all things in my life are not the same without the most important thing. I like reading, I like listening to music, I really like very much working on the computer now that I’m able to. But..." She stops looking at her hands.

I've never seen so much sadness on the face of a 22-year-old girl. This time it's I that wants to hug her. But I do not. I strain to speak of the next initiative we’re thinking of organizing for her, like a meeting with the president of the Seattle-Perugia twinning association, Mike James, who I will meet here in Italy in a few weeks. But I’m not able to continue without confessing to her my anxiety. I look at her.

I take a deep breath before speaking: "I feel sad knowing what you going through”. Amanda apologizes, as if she is to blame for my discouragement. "I'm sorry, it’s... is that I was thinking of the situation, the birthday. You know, all the birthdays I have spent here I have not celebrated that much, throughout. I think I'll celebrate my birthday when I get home. I know it's something a bit strange, but when I think of celebrating my birthday, I imagine it with my family. And if they are not there for me is not a birthday".

"Even the last time we left, the last time we were here, we were sad after leaving” I reveal to her. "I'm so sorry...."

"Look Amanda, among friends there should never be pretence, especially with regards to feelings. A female friend or a male friend is good also for to say: "I'm sad”. There is no sense in forcing one so appears to be happy, if it is not true. As there is no reason in you not saying what you feel, as it wouldn’t be a reason for us to be covering from you what we see and feel. It's part of friendship, is part of life also to share the moments when the smile tarnishes for a while. But the sincerity of feelings is something so beautiful and so rare that it is worth even a moment of sadness".

Now she is close to me, so fragile. If I think of what they wrote and said about her, it seems I live in an unreal dimension. I remember the episode when the great Oriana Fallaci met with the South Vietnamese General Nguyen Ngoc Loan, head of the National Police of the Republic of Vietnam. Escaped from Vietnam, took refuge in the United States, where he opened a pizzeria in the suburbs of Washington DC. For her, probably, it was to be only just an encounter with a General portrayed everywhere as ruthless, one who callously executed Vietcongs with a shot to the head in front of the Associated Press photographers, like the famous photo taken at Saigon that’s been shown around the world. Instead they talked of other things, the family, the children, about life.

The meeting between the author and former army General was long, intense, full of sensibility. At the end she hugged him. In her book “Nothing and so be it”, the General is quoted several times. Fallaci wrote about him: "When you realize that good and evil are points of view, as the true and false, right and wrong, every road seems uncertain, and any opinion arbitrary. Feel sure only of your doubts".

"With the computer what kind of work are you doing for the university?" I ask her to brake these moments of bitterness and despair. "I'm writing a lot. I am writing short stories in Italian and English, which then I send to my professor. As you know, he has in fact built a sort of course for me, so I can continue with the university. He’s been very kind towards me. And the computer helps me so very much”.

Back to smiling, telling me of her studies. "We saw a priest that we don’t known him long, during our visit. Are you doing activities with him?”. "I don’t know who he is, I saw that he speaking with Don Saulo."

Don Saulo Scarabattoli is the Catholic priest who attends the female section; each day he brings his spiritual support to the detainees. He is one of the people who knows Amanda more deeply and to whom she confides in since she is been here. To be clear, if Amanda were a believer, we could say that he is her confessor.

"You always go to mass, right?". "Yes, in fact Don Saulo counts on me to recite the exhortations during mass. I'm used to reading the Bible and learn certain lessons. I started in high school. I went to a Jesuit school and I tried to study the Bible in order to understand the things it contains. There are not many people here who have a spiritual training which allows to express a thought that it complements what is read during church service. We are two usually who write the exhortations. And so far I have missed only one mass, when I was in court".

"Actually, you missed another because of us: I remember once you arrived with a prayer leaflet in your hand and you told us you were at mass" I joke smiling.

"In fact, you're right. And Don Saulo then asked me where I went and why did I have to leave in the middle of mass…" she says.

"Excuse me Amanda, I'm no theologian, but if you're not a believer can you all the same read texts and exhortations during the church service? Forgive the question, I do not want to get in your spirituality and your privacy, but is just for understanding".

"I've talked about this with Don Saulo. He appreciates my attitude toward the Bible. I am not a believer, it is true, but I’m not closed to what the Bible may say. And you know what? ".

"Tell me, Amanda..." "Don Saulo is convinced that I will become a nun,” reveals after a moment of silence. "He sees that I read the prayers with sincerity, and that I hear them with just as much sincerity".

I ponder in silence, once again, how the media image that is built on a person is so distant and detached from the true spirit and the feeling that this girl in front of me raises, face to face, whoever gets closer to her inner side.

"I honestly think is a rather remote hypothesis". I say to her.

"Oh, yes. I also think the same as you".

"We instead we see you married, with a husband and children. But not with the Tibetan monk husband from the dream though…".

She even joins in laughter, together with me.

"A few days ago I attended a debate sponsored by the University for Foreigners, here in Perugia, sponsored by the Italy-USA Foundation. Theme was "Obama, between criticism and consensus." Think that before we started there were people who even wanted to talk about your case during the debate. Obviously I opposed to it".

"It would have been a very stupid thing, what have I got to do with Obama?” She asks, quite rightly appalled.

"Nothing. In fact it would have been the odd instrumental twist, perhaps to catch a bit of the media spotlight on the cheap. I said that if they brought up the case of Meredith, I'd be gone. We addressed the President’s serious crisis of approval, so soon after his election".

"I heard that it fell below 50 percent. I do not understand why people don’t give him the chance to try to do something. "

"You know, the mood of voters, particularly American ones, are very fickle. In one way or another" I tell her while in the meantime we get to the books that we brought for her this time.

Editorial
Wednesday, October 27, 2010
Panorama-Blog
br-))



I started to read this and simply can't get through it. Girlanda is wretched, simply wretched. However, a couple of things need saying:

1. Note that Mike James, former KING newscaster and head of the Seattle-Perugia sister city association, collaborated in some way on this sorry excuse for a book. Mike, are you reading here still (he is a member of PMF)? Shame, shame on you!

2. Girlanda has no business even mentioning the name of Oriana Fallaci. Shame, shame on you, Rocco!

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Offline tsit


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Posts: 62

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:34 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

capealadin wrote:
So, a quick recap. Amanda has gone from : * The NAZI within* to SHALOM. From being agnostic..to EVANGELICAL!!! Is there no end to this manipulative bitch?????????????/


God must hang out in prisons "cause a lot of prisoners find him there.
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Offline bucketoftea


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Posts: 1377

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:43 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

mortytoad wrote:
A non believer who can recite prayers and verses from the bible with sincerity would be an actress?

Quite. And a priest who thinks she will be a nun is a chump.
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Offline The 411


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Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2009 6:49 pm

Posts: 1386

PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 10:52 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

lisareik wrote:
bucketoftea wrote:
h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
Jools... the translations are priceless! Thanks for doing this for the board. You are a star!


Absolutely. Thanks.

Just BTB, I wonder what the psychologists make of AK tracing round her hand by way of a signature. Anyone?


Can you tell where this took place? In what context?
Thank you.


Hi, Lisa:
Amanda frequently (or always?)ends her letters to Rocco by tracing the outline of her hand onto the paper--like this illustration.

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Offline Jools


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:39 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

This trans continues yesterday's crap about the digital camera hanging from Knoxy's neck. em)

As soon as I enter the place colour painted in orange and lime green to remind us that we are young, I hear the music coming from the piano. The whole room seems full and a shiver runs up and down my back, as if I was suddenly surrounded by water. I feel the desire to take a picture of the whole room, like the panoramic 360 degrees shoot under the ocean which I've never done, but which sooner or later I will. Instead, I approach the piano and begin to photograph it. It is a beautiful grand piano placed in the center of a green and orange room, is like a black pearl on a bed of neon like moss. Black and shiny, resembles a puddle of water darken by shadows. One student same age as me is sitting at the piano playing. His hands are the most beautiful I have ever seen: big and white, with long and elegant fingers that resembled rays of sunshine. They seem endowed with own volition, because the rest of his body sways as if he is in a trance, or submerged under water. I zoom frame the hands in the camera. The student does not stop playing, but he freezes, opens his eyes and looks at me. "Hello" he says.
I never imagined that he could move and so I feel a little uncomfortable, because instead is clear he can. I turn the back of the camera towards him, where there is a small screen. "Hello," I say. "You want to see?"

I'm in the computer room in the art department, because I told him he could find me here. It's late and I'm alone, so I play with Photoshop. I want to see how many alterations are needed to transform my portray into that of my mother. Definitely few: we both have a round face with high cheekbones and big oval eyes with heavy eyelids; my lips are fuller and larger, her nose is more subtle, our colour is different: I try to fade the freckles blending my pale skin with her more rosy tones and make the blue of my eyes fade to gray, I need a complete hair transplant: mine is like the heat wave that rises from the ground during a sunny and muggy day, while my mom’s is like the rain that pours down for hours.
When the transformation is complete the face is undoubtedly that of my mother, although she appears younger and with smoother skin, because I'm not an expert in Photoshop. And I realize that I really look like her a lot, because even under the disguise, I am unmistakable.

I walk away from the picture and I pretend is not quite one of my photos. Becomes untouchable and relative, like the hanging framed pictures in a gallery. By putting down my chin in the palm of the hand, I think I'm becoming every day more like my mother, as if the youth years were layers peeling off and inside there was her seed. The general idea is that we are all fruits of our parents, and that after a certain amount of sun, wind and rain we mellow and mature in their image. But I think what makes me like my mother is not something that can be transformed by the elements and time, but something that comes to light because it's always been there. I am my mother inside, and everything that you see different on the surface does not make me different than her.

He did not come. I'm going home.
Clouds ...
White whispers cradling the golden light –
Like eggs –
That they hatch and expand –
That they dissolve –
That they gather in great little gray scoops –
Creamy, frothy, frozen and melted –
Heat and Hunger –
A full stomach –
The mind weakened by the sun –
A carefree smile –
A hand that rests against the cheek of another –
Mix –
Drink –
Thirst -
Sleep -

Winter is coming and I feel like taking stocks, hide and curl up like a squirrel. It makes me think of home, my parents and hole up with them and take lots of candid photos. It is an art form able to know how to capture even the most embarrassing moment even when someone speaks with the mouth full or makes a face. Is not necessarily something generally admitted, but it brings out a beauty that makes sense only to those who know the subject in person and who can appreciate the lost look, the messy hair and mess up facial contortions. The trick is not to look into the camera when taking the photo and leave everything to chance, capturing the image even when you least expect it. The occupational photos I take of my family end up in albums, one each year. The others are still around, scattered like fallen leaves, for when I'm lonely, nostalgic or empty.

I go back to the room to see if he is there. I want to see his hands again, so independent, because I feel lonely without them. While I go down the stairs, I see he is there. The room is full of music and yet no one but me to hear it and I wonder why. He is back in a trance; I zoom in by the stairs and I photograph him, this time the face. I feel a tingle of excitement, curiosity, admiration and a sudden sense of well being that I try to grab. He opens his eyes and looks at the lens while I photograph him: he doesn’t smile, doesn’t get mad and does not even stop playing. The music stops only when I lower the camera.
p-(((
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2008 5:36 pm

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 11:56 pm   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

AK: "Even under the disguise, I am unmistakable."

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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:02 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
This trans continues yesterday's crap about the digital camera hanging from Knoxy's neck. em)

As soon as I enter the place colour painted in orange and lime green to remind us that we are young, I hear the music coming from the piano. The whole room seems full and a shiver runs up and down my back, as if I was suddenly surrounded by water. I feel the desire to take a picture of the whole room, like the panoramic 360 degrees shoot under the ocean which I've never done, but which sooner or later I will. Instead, I approach the piano and begin to photograph it. It is a beautiful grand piano placed in the center of a green and orange room, is like a black pearl on a bed of neon like moss. Black and shiny, resembles a puddle of water darken by shadows. One student same age as me is sitting at the piano playing. His hands are the most beautiful I have ever seen: big and white, with long and elegant fingers that resembled rays of sunshine. They seem endowed with own volition, because the rest of his body sways as if he is in a trance, or submerged under water. I zoom frame the hands in the camera. The student does not stop playing, but he freezes, opens his eyes and looks at me. "Hello" he says.
I never imagined that he could move and so I feel a little uncomfortable, because instead is clear he can. I turn the back of the camera towards him, where there is a small screen. "Hello," I say. "You want to see?"

I'm in the computer room in the art department, because I told him he could find me here. It's late and I'm alone, so I play with Photoshop. I want to see how many alterations are needed to transform my portray into that of my mother. Definitely few: we both have a round face with high cheekbones and big oval eyes with heavy eyelids; my lips are fuller and larger, her nose is more subtle, our colour is different: I try to fade the freckles blending my pale skin with her more rosy tones and make the blue of my eyes fade to gray, I need a complete hair transplant: mine is like the heat wave that rises from the ground during a sunny and muggy day, while my mom’s is like the rain that pours down for hours.
When the transformation is complete the face is undoubtedly that of my mother, although she appears younger and with smoother skin, because I'm not an expert in Photoshop. And I realize that I really look like her a lot, because even under the disguise, I am unmistakable.

I walk away from the picture and I pretend is not quite one of my photos. Becomes untouchable and relative, like the hanging framed pictures in a gallery. By putting down my chin in the palm of the hand, I think I'm becoming every day more like my mother, as if the youth years were layers peeling off and inside there was her seed. The general idea is that we are all fruits of our parents, and that after a certain amount of sun, wind and rain we mellow and mature in their image. But I think what makes me like my mother is not something that can be transformed by the elements and time, but something that comes to light because it's always been there. I am my mother inside, and everything that you see different on the surface does not make me different than her.

He did not come. I'm going home.
Clouds ...
White whispers cradling the golden light –
Like eggs –
That they hatch and expand –
That they dissolve –
That they gather in great little gray scoops –
Creamy, frothy, frozen and melted –
Heat and Hunger –
A full stomach –
The mind weakened by the sun –
A carefree smile –
A hand that rests against the cheek of another –
Mix –
Drink –
Thirst -
Sleep -

Winter is coming and I feel like taking stocks, hide and curl up like a squirrel. It makes me think of home, my parents and hole up with them and take lots of candid photos. It is an art form able to know how to capture even the most embarrassing moment even when someone speaks with the mouth full or makes a face. Is not necessarily something generally admitted, but it brings out a beauty that makes sense only to those who know the subject in person and who can appreciate the lost look, the messy hair and mess up facial contortions. The trick is not to look into the camera when taking the photo and leave everything to chance, capturing the image even when you least expect it. The occupational photos I take of my family end up in albums, one each year. The others are still around, scattered like fallen leaves, for when I'm lonely, nostalgic or empty.

I go back to the room to see if he is there. I want to see his hands again, so independent, because I feel lonely without them. While I go down the stairs, I see he is there. The room is full of music and yet no one but me to hear it and I wonder why. He is back in a trance; I zoom in by the stairs and I photograph him, this time the face. I feel a tingle of excitement, curiosity, admiration and a sudden sense of well being that I try to grab. He opens his eyes and looks at the lens while I photograph him: he doesn’t smile, doesn’t get mad and does not even stop playing. The music stops only when I lower the camera.
p-(((



Umm, just wondering what this is supposed to be exactly. Is it from a dream journal or some kind of creative writing exercise or a letter to Girlanda?

The level of self-indulgence on the part of AK and of indulgence on the part of Girlanda (and Mike James, apparently) is staggering. I am having a hard time believing that this crap was actually published.

_________________
Le coeur a ses raisons que la raison ne connait point; on le sait en mille choses.
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Offline norbertc


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Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2009 1:16 am

Posts: 307

Location: France

Highscores: 2

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:06 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Corrina wrote:
She goes to mass at every opportunity.

Having known a few people who found themselves on the wrong side of the law, none of whom were the least bit religious, they all went to any religious service they could just to get out of the cell. Nothing new here.


Oh, I'd say that the reasons why our hypocritical murderess now wears religion on her sleeve are fairly obvious. All part of her appeal makeover. Italy is a Catholic country. So, how can it hurt her?

Look for a contrite demeanor and a conservative wardrobe for November. The pearl earrings in the photo (left) are a nice touch. I ask you: could this charming individual possibly be guilty of a bloody drugs-, alcohol- and/or sex-fueled murder? I'm hoping and expecting to see a discreet gold crucifix hanging from her neck as the appeals kick off.



Last edited by norbertc on Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:27 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Offline Jools


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Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:38 pm

Posts: 2241

Location: Spain

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:13 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Skeptical Bystander wrote:
Jools wrote:
This trans continues yesterday's crap about the digital camera hanging from Knoxy's neck. em)

As soon as I enter the place colour painted in orange and lime green to remind us that we are young, I hear the music coming from the piano. The whole room seems full and a shiver runs up and down my back, as if I was suddenly surrounded by water. I feel the desire to take a picture of the whole room, like the panoramic 360 degrees shoot under the ocean which I've never done, but which sooner or later I will. Instead, I approach the piano and begin to photograph it. It is a beautiful grand piano placed in the center of a green and orange room, is like a black pearl on a bed of neon like moss. Black and shiny, resembles a puddle of water darken by shadows. One student same age as me is sitting at the piano playing. His hands are the most beautiful I have ever seen: big and white, with long and elegant fingers that resembled rays of sunshine. They seem endowed with own volition, because the rest of his body sways as if he is in a trance, or submerged under water. I zoom frame the hands in the camera. The student does not stop playing, but he freezes, opens his eyes and looks at me. "Hello" he says.
I never imagined that he could move and so I feel a little uncomfortable, because instead is clear he can. I turn the back of the camera towards him, where there is a small screen. "Hello," I say. "You want to see?"

I'm in the computer room in the art department, because I told him he could find me here. It's late and I'm alone, so I play with Photoshop. I want to see how many alterations are needed to transform my portray into that of my mother. Definitely few: we both have a round face with high cheekbones and big oval eyes with heavy eyelids; my lips are fuller and larger, her nose is more subtle, our colour is different: I try to fade the freckles blending my pale skin with her more rosy tones and make the blue of my eyes fade to gray, I need a complete hair transplant: mine is like the heat wave that rises from the ground during a sunny and muggy day, while my mom’s is like the rain that pours down for hours.
When the transformation is complete the face is undoubtedly that of my mother, although she appears younger and with smoother skin, because I'm not an expert in Photoshop. And I realize that I really look like her a lot, because even under the disguise, I am unmistakable.

I walk away from the picture and I pretend is not quite one of my photos. Becomes untouchable and relative, like the hanging framed pictures in a gallery. By putting down my chin in the palm of the hand, I think I'm becoming every day more like my mother, as if the youth years were layers peeling off and inside there was her seed. The general idea is that we are all fruits of our parents, and that after a certain amount of sun, wind and rain we mellow and mature in their image. But I think what makes me like my mother is not something that can be transformed by the elements and time, but something that comes to light because it's always been there. I am my mother inside, and everything that you see different on the surface does not make me different than her.

He did not come. I'm going home.
Clouds ...
White whispers cradling the golden light –
Like eggs –
That they hatch and expand –
That they dissolve –
That they gather in great little gray scoops –
Creamy, frothy, frozen and melted –
Heat and Hunger –
A full stomach –
The mind weakened by the sun –
A carefree smile –
A hand that rests against the cheek of another –
Mix –
Drink –
Thirst -
Sleep -

Winter is coming and I feel like taking stocks, hide and curl up like a squirrel. It makes me think of home, my parents and hole up with them and take lots of candid photos. It is an art form able to know how to capture even the most embarrassing moment even when someone speaks with the mouth full or makes a face. Is not necessarily something generally admitted, but it brings out a beauty that makes sense only to those who know the subject in person and who can appreciate the lost look, the messy hair and mess up facial contortions. The trick is not to look into the camera when taking the photo and leave everything to chance, capturing the image even when you least expect it. The occupational photos I take of my family end up in albums, one each year. The others are still around, scattered like fallen leaves, for when I'm lonely, nostalgic or empty.

I go back to the room to see if he is there. I want to see his hands again, so independent, because I feel lonely without them. While I go down the stairs, I see he is there. The room is full of music and yet no one but me to hear it and I wonder why. He is back in a trance; I zoom in by the stairs and I photograph him, this time the face. I feel a tingle of excitement, curiosity, admiration and a sudden sense of well being that I try to grab. He opens his eyes and looks at the lens while I photograph him: he doesn’t smile, doesn’t get mad and does not even stop playing. The music stops only when I lower the camera.
p-(((



Umm, just wondering what this is supposed to be exactly. Is it from a dream journal or some kind of creative writing exercise or a letter to Girlanda?

The level of self-indulgence on the part of AK and of indulgence on the part of Girlanda (and Mike James, apparently) is staggering. I am having a hard time believing that this crap was actually published.


:lol: :lol:

They are suppose to be the poems and short stories that Knox sent or gave in hand to Girlanda and form the first pages of the 'I'm coming with you' book.

A real piece of doo doo that nobody in their right mind will buy. n-((
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2008 5:36 pm

Posts: 7006

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:55 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:
Jools wrote:
This trans continues yesterday's crap about the digital camera hanging from Knoxy's neck. em)

As soon as I enter the place colour painted in orange and lime green to remind us that we are young, I hear the music coming from the piano. The whole room seems full and a shiver runs up and down my back, as if I was suddenly surrounded by water. I feel the desire to take a picture of the whole room, like the panoramic 360 degrees shoot under the ocean which I've never done, but which sooner or later I will. Instead, I approach the piano and begin to photograph it. It is a beautiful grand piano placed in the center of a green and orange room, is like a black pearl on a bed of neon like moss. Black and shiny, resembles a puddle of water darken by shadows. One student same age as me is sitting at the piano playing. His hands are the most beautiful I have ever seen: big and white, with long and elegant fingers that resembled rays of sunshine. They seem endowed with own volition, because the rest of his body sways as if he is in a trance, or submerged under water. I zoom frame the hands in the camera. The student does not stop playing, but he freezes, opens his eyes and looks at me. "Hello" he says.
I never imagined that he could move and so I feel a little uncomfortable, because instead is clear he can. I turn the back of the camera towards him, where there is a small screen. "Hello," I say. "You want to see?"

I'm in the computer room in the art department, because I told him he could find me here. It's late and I'm alone, so I play with Photoshop. I want to see how many alterations are needed to transform my portray into that of my mother. Definitely few: we both have a round face with high cheekbones and big oval eyes with heavy eyelids; my lips are fuller and larger, her nose is more subtle, our colour is different: I try to fade the freckles blending my pale skin with her more rosy tones and make the blue of my eyes fade to gray, I need a complete hair transplant: mine is like the heat wave that rises from the ground during a sunny and muggy day, while my mom’s is like the rain that pours down for hours.
When the transformation is complete the face is undoubtedly that of my mother, although she appears younger and with smoother skin, because I'm not an expert in Photoshop. And I realize that I really look like her a lot, because even under the disguise, I am unmistakable.

I walk away from the picture and I pretend is not quite one of my photos. Becomes untouchable and relative, like the hanging framed pictures in a gallery. By putting down my chin in the palm of the hand, I think I'm becoming every day more like my mother, as if the youth years were layers peeling off and inside there was her seed. The general idea is that we are all fruits of our parents, and that after a certain amount of sun, wind and rain we mellow and mature in their image. But I think what makes me like my mother is not something that can be transformed by the elements and time, but something that comes to light because it's always been there. I am my mother inside, and everything that you see different on the surface does not make me different than her.

He did not come. I'm going home.
Clouds ...
White whispers cradling the golden light –
Like eggs –
That they hatch and expand –
That they dissolve –
That they gather in great little gray scoops –
Creamy, frothy, frozen and melted –
Heat and Hunger –
A full stomach –
The mind weakened by the sun –
A carefree smile –
A hand that rests against the cheek of another –
Mix –
Drink –
Thirst -
Sleep -

Winter is coming and I feel like taking stocks, hide and curl up like a squirrel. It makes me think of home, my parents and hole up with them and take lots of candid photos. It is an art form able to know how to capture even the most embarrassing moment even when someone speaks with the mouth full or makes a face. Is not necessarily something generally admitted, but it brings out a beauty that makes sense only to those who know the subject in person and who can appreciate the lost look, the messy hair and mess up facial contortions. The trick is not to look into the camera when taking the photo and leave everything to chance, capturing the image even when you least expect it. The occupational photos I take of my family end up in albums, one each year. The others are still around, scattered like fallen leaves, for when I'm lonely, nostalgic or empty.

I go back to the room to see if he is there. I want to see his hands again, so independent, because I feel lonely without them. While I go down the stairs, I see he is there. The room is full of music and yet no one but me to hear it and I wonder why. He is back in a trance; I zoom in by the stairs and I photograph him, this time the face. I feel a tingle of excitement, curiosity, admiration and a sudden sense of well being that I try to grab. He opens his eyes and looks at the lens while I photograph him: he doesn’t smile, doesn’t get mad and does not even stop playing. The music stops only when I lower the camera.
p-(((



Umm, just wondering what this is supposed to be exactly. Is it from a dream journal or some kind of creative writing exercise or a letter to Girlanda?

The level of self-indulgence on the part of AK and of indulgence on the part of Girlanda (and Mike James, apparently) is staggering. I am having a hard time believing that this crap was actually published.


:lol: :lol:

They are suppose to be the poems and short stories that Knox sent or gave in hand to Girlanda and form the first pages of the 'I'm coming with you' book.

A real piece of doo doo that nobody in their right mind will buy. n-((



It was probably an error for Oriana Girlanda to allow excerpts to be published.

Oops! Did I just call him Oriana?

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Le coeur a ses raisons que la raison ne connait point; on le sait en mille choses.
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Offline mimi


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Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:42 pm

Posts: 14

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:56 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Attachment:
wshangel.jpg
Though I greatly appreciate the intelligence and diligence displayed on this site, the reverse contrast is a challenge to my eyes, hence my infrequent visits. A few, brief responses to recent posts, and then I'll rest my weary orbs!
Re: the Madpax photo choseen as covershot for "Rocco's Adventures in Girl Land"-- the brat could only look more saintlike with a halo.
Skep signed off on Facebook, which she feels encourages adults to behave like elementary school children. And Edda, the elementary teacher, wishes the world to see her angel as though she were a perpetual fourth grader.
Earthling: I don't know whether AK attended S Prep on scholarship, but Meredith's Erasmus award has been suggested as another possible thorn in AK's self-funded backside...
"Shalom? Shalom?'' What next? Perhaps she'll change her penname from "Marie Pace" to "Marie Shalom". Both translate to peace. (Why not be more accurate, and call yourself "Marie Piece"?)
A sweet little girl who wouldn't hurt a fly...


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Offline Yummi


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Joined: Mon Apr 27, 2009 9:29 pm

Posts: 975

Location: Bunga-Bunga Republic

PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 1:01 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander wrote:
“Io vengo con te” – book presentation
Rome, October 26 2010 17:30-18:45 - Palazzo Marini

I’ll just write down what I found significant in no particular order.

I had lunch in a bookstore next to Palazzo Chigi yesterday. One hour later I realized I had read half of Girlanda’s book. It’s a really easy read. Too easy.
It’s all about “me, me, me and more me” (sound familiar?).
He promotes himself (and his foundation) so much in the book that at a certain point I was not sure if the book was about Amanda Knox. Girlanda and Knox are using each other.


Beautiful report!

And this about Girlanda's book was exactly what I was writing in a post that I never finished. I happaned to enter Mel bookstore last week and - i was unprepared, I didn't expect it - i saw the book in a pile, between Umberto Eco, Giulio Giorello and political pamphlets. I just read a few pages and with my utter disgust i found out exactly what you notice: the book is not really about Amanda Knox, she is a pretext, it is a mutual use. The book is to promote Girlanda and his foundation. Any "discussion" with Amanda is pretext to inflate the role of his foundation, if is a pseudo-heroical self-portrait, how good he is and how much they do, a self serving picture of reality, a favolistic rendering of economical crisis, a fiction, a ridiculous anestetyzed fairy tale if you just consider what the truth of situation of Italy is.
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Offline Yummi


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 1:13 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The Girlanda book about Amanda knox has an outlook similar to Piemme's agiographic books about Mother Teresa. If anything, this book could have an effect: could be a spur to Rudy Guede to finally speak. Because Rudy is the only one who in his writing seems to have a genuine literary teste. The book depicting Knox as an icon is such bad taste literaure, that could sort out the effect.
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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 1:18 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Hi mimi!
What a terrific "piece" of artwork!!!!!

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Offline Skeptical Bystander


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 1:46 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Yummi wrote:
The Girlanda book about Amanda knox has an outlook similar to Piemme's agiographic books about Mother Teresa. If anything, this book could have an effect: could be a spur to Rudy Guede to finally speak. Because Rudy is the only one who in his writing seems to have a genuine literary teste. The book depicting Knox as an icon is such bad taste literaure, that could sort out the effect.



The hagiographic approach is tasteless beyond belief. I have a hard time believing that Mike James, David Marriott and the family really understood what Girlanda was planning to publish. It's embarrassing, in fact.

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Offline thoughtful


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 1:59 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Clander - Greetings from Japan - too busy here to read regularly, I'm afraid - but just saw your report on Girlanda! Wonderful, like being there. Forbidden picture - way to go! (Whoever took it, of course.) Too bad nothing to report on the subject of Amanda from the Land of the Rising Sun.
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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:14 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

The 411 wrote:
lisareik wrote:
bucketoftea wrote:
h9A7wa9i1K wrote:
Jools... the translations are priceless! Thanks for doing this for the board. You are a star!


Absolutely. Thanks.

Just BTB, I wonder what the psychologists make of AK tracing round her hand by way of a signature. Anyone?


Can you tell where this took place? In what context?
Thank you.


Hi, Lisa:
Amanda frequently (or always?)ends her letters to Rocco by tracing the outline of her hand onto the paper--like this illustration.


What is she, 5 years old? Sheesh. That was a kindergarten trick.

Oh, and greetings, thoughtful.... hope you're having a nice trip in Japan! nin-)
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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:24 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Reading as much of *that* as I could, I had to stop. I could FEEL the screws tightening. Torture. The best I can say about reading this drivel, is that this woman has NO personality. There's just.......nothing.

Jools, I really think you should have a trophy in your avatar. GOLD. ( I kinda miss mine :( )

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Offline capealadin


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:25 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Earthling: Someone must have told her once that she had nice hands.......

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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:30 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

stilicho wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:
SomeAlibi wrote:
Jools wrote:
**I'd like to share my eyes with everyone -

**********


You are absolutely kidding me? I'm so sorry to do this to such a highly respected poster but you are saying that is a direct posting of her words - all of the above? Seriously?

I am, no comedy involved, radically re-evaluating my view on Knox this evening if this is from her hand. Seriously. Probably the biggest wow in a long time.


My translation: Amanda Knox is trying to read that book by Marcel Proust given to her by the nice Italian politician. She doesn't really understand it but wanted to share this relative lack of understanding with the world since she seems to have its attention. A captive audience. Someone pass me the bong, please. I need more.
Raindrops
Roses
Whiskers
Kittens
Warm woollen mittens
Madeleine
Maman
Magic Lanterne
Gigot d'agneau
Sauce gibberish
Nudity
Navel gazing


It is pretty hideous, isn't it.

I'd be much happier just reading in her own words why she killed Meredith and accused her boss of murder. In plain English or plain Italian--doesn't matter.

Amen, brother.
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Offline Tara


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:03 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

DAILY MAIL

Many pictures from shooting the film here...it also made one of the tabloid TV magazines, Inside Edition.

Blech!


JOOLS! Awesome and thank you! hugz-)


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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:35 am   Post subject: TYPO   

Tara wrote:
DAILY MAIL

Many pictures from shooting the film here...it also made one of the tabloid TV magazines, Inside Edition.
)


"Daily Mail"
Caption Typo spotted here...

"Carefree: In these scenes, before the body of Meredith Kercher is found, Amanda and Raffaele - who will receive 26 and 25 year sentences respectively - are in the throws of a six-day romance."

Were they "THROWS" like this????? rt-)) rt-)) rt-))
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Offline Tiziano


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:39 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Greetings to all PMFers: I'm catching up on 10 weeks' reading, so do not know whether the news on the Panettiere film has hit PMF yet.

Here's a link anyway to some photos:

http://www.style.it/vanitypeople/in-pic ... -knox.aspx
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Offline The 411


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 3:48 am   Post subject: THE TASMANIAN TREASURE is BACK!!   

Tiziano wrote:
Greetings to all PMFers: I'm catching up on 10 weeks' reading, so do not know whether the news on the Panettiere film has hit PMF yet.

Here's a link anyway to some photos:

http://www.style.it/vanitypeople/in-pic ... -knox.aspx


TIZIANO, the TASMANIAN TREASURE IS IN THE HOUSE!!! (FYI I had just mentioned you in a YOUTUBE post earlier today!)
WELCOME BACK, Tiziano! And BUONA LETTURA!! 10 WEEKS' of reading???? :shock: In bocca al lupo!!


hugz-)
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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 4:09 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Jools wrote:
Skeptical Bystander wrote:
Umm, just wondering what this is supposed to be exactly. Is it from a dream journal or some kind of creative writing exercise or a letter to Girlanda?

The level of self-indulgence on the part of AK and of indulgence on the part of Girlanda (and Mike James, apparently) is staggering. I am having a hard time believing that this crap was actually published.


:lol: :lol:

They are suppose to be the poems and short stories that Knox sent or gave in hand to Girlanda and form the first pages of the 'I'm coming with you' book.

A real piece of doo doo that nobody in their right mind will buy. n-((

As my Dad would have said, it would be good for some things.

Things like lining the cat box. Or tearing out the pages, so you can save on toilet paper.

But of course, Sam's Club sells that sort of thing much cheaper.
d-))
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Offline guermantes

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:08 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Check out this funny bit in the article from the London Evening Standard:

"The TV film, called Lifetime, :) will focus on events surrounding the death of Miss Kercher, 21, from Coulsdon, ..."

This is London

Could that reporter please do his homework next time? :roll:

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Panettiere-Romio.jpg


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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:13 am   Post subject: Re: Missing Meredith   

The 411 wrote:
Earthling wrote:


Okay. And here's an interview where Meredith Kercher gives all her intimate thoughts on religion, birthdays, and Obama:

Quote:







EARTHLING:

THE SILENCE IS DEAFENING. And that's very, very sad, and it makes us all very angry, too.

Meredith's absence has been felt acutely and WILL be felt acutely every day, literally for longer than any of us will be alive. That pain and loss will live on for generations, because Meredith's nieces and nephews and all future Kercher generations will know OF her, but will they will NEVER have the joy of knowing HER and all the potential she had.

Thank you, THE 411, for saying some things that needed to be said. They are soooo true. ss)

And you're right about the generations. I hadn't really thought of it that way before, but it's true, too.

The 411 wrote:
A question about Manders' unprecedented celebrity : There have been scores of repugnant murders, especially in recent decades.
But has there ever been an UNREPENTANT convicted killer in history, who has been so fawned over, so coddled --ever??? I can't even begin to think of another murderer, WITH NOTHING SPECIAL TO OFFER, with such a deluded fan base.

I can't think of anyone. Maybe Genghis Khan in his prime. Mua-)

But seriously, I really, truly can't think of anyone. And you're right, it is soooo sick!!!! And I believe that if she were "overweight" or "fugly" (however you define those terms, sorry for the un-PC language), then, "we wouldn't even be having this conversation," as they say in Brooklyn.

I think the closest might be the way some (mostly, but not entirely, in the Black community) continued to treat OJ Simpson. Of course, he was officially acquitted, so they had more reason than with Mandy. But even that was pretty limited.

So, nope, I really can't think of anyone. Can anyone else? I know individual murderers have had their fans. But this sort of fawning of a whole class of mostly middle-aged white men, plus some seemingly blinkered women, and magnified by a fawning and intimidated press throughout America (now reaching its tentacles into Italy), just does seem unprecedented to me, as well. Anyone?

The 411 wrote:
And what's this about her having received a laptop from Rocco ? Is that just for word processing? Why hadn't AK had a computer before this, perhaps selected by and given to her by Chris, if prison regulations permitted this?

Or, did Girlanda break a few rules to insure Little Angel had her own up-to-date computer.

Exactly how many inmates, besides Manders there have their own laptop, Onorevole Girlanda? st-))

I wouldn't be surprised if some of those laptop-less inmates have already CONFESSED to their crime, and are making great efforts to reform themselves while in prison.

Wouldn't THOSE INMATES be MUCH MORE DESERVING of your generosity?


Good point. I wonder if Manders has access to the Internet. Really wouldn't want her reading her own press.


Last edited by Earthling on Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Offline Earthling


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 5:53 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

mimi wrote:
Attachment:
wshangel.jpg
Though I greatly appreciate the intelligence and diligence displayed on this site, the reverse contrast is a challenge to my eyes, hence my infrequent visits. A few, brief responses to recent posts, and then I'll rest my weary orbs!
Re: the Madpax photo choseen as covershot for "Rocco's Adventures in Girl Land"-- the brat could only look more saintlike with a halo.
Skep signed off on Facebook, which she feels encourages adults to behave like elementary school children. And Edda, the elementary teacher, wishes the world to see her angel as though she were a perpetual fourth grader.
Earthling: I don't know whether AK attended S Prep on scholarship, but Meredith's Erasmus award has been suggested as another possible thorn in AK's self-funded backside...
"Shalom? Shalom?'' What next? Perhaps she'll change her penname from "Marie Pace" to "Marie Shalom". Both translate to peace. (Why not be more accurate, and call yourself "Marie Piece"?)
A sweet little girl who wouldn't hurt a fly...

Hi mimi! Thanks for attempting to answer my question wrt: Amanda's tuition at Seattle Prep. It does seem a bit odd that she was able to attend, what with the documented problems with Curt's child support. And I agree that could have added to her jealousy of Meredith's award.

And I love your picture! So funny and if that's supposed to be Amanda, she really does look somewhat psycho. ss-)

p.s. You have only 2 posts here? Wow, a high signal-to-noise ratio!

p.p.s. Good to see you again, Tiziano!
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Offline tom_ch


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 6:54 am   Post subject: Re: XIX. MAIN DISCUSSION, AUGUST 19 -   

Tara wrote:
DAILY MAIL

Many pictures from shooting the film here...it also made one of the tabloid TV magazines, Inside Edition.

Blech!


JOOLS! Awesome and thank you! hugz-)

"Original: The set bears a striking resemblance to the house owned by Meredith Kercher"

Owned?

Tom
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